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What the Marine Did (Warning: Graphic language)
Slate ^ | 19 November 2004 | Owen West and Phillip Carter

Posted on 11/19/2004 7:18:05 AM PST by IGOTMINE

Edited on 11/19/2004 9:12:33 AM PST by Admin Moderator. [history]

A Marine shot an unarmed insurgent in a Fallujah mosque on Saturday. We know this because we saw it. The digital video footage of the shooting—recorded by NBC reporter Kevin Sites, who was embedded with the Marines—is running nearly continuously on cable news channels worldwide. We heard it, too. A Marine says: "He's f*****g faking he's dead. He's faking he's fucking dead." The Marine comes into view with his rifle shouldered. There is a rifle shot. An Iraqi leaning against a wall slumps, leaving a blood stain behind. According to CNN, another Marine says, "Well, he's dead now."

This case would not exist without Mr. Sites. That a young soldier deferred to instinct over the rulebook in combat is unsurprising. What was surprising was the near-instant transmission of a battlefield video around the world, allowing us to witness the actions of one American rifleman. Judging by the swift condemnation from all over, the world is drawing its own conclusion about what happened in the bloody mosque. But to judge the Marine fairly takes more perspective and context. The video is clear enough, but truly understanding requires navigating an underlying landscape littered with legal ambiguity and moral craters.


TOPICS: Breaking News; News/Current Events
KEYWORDS: fallujahmarine; napalminthemorning; partyofthehindparts; religionofpeace; slanderngprivateryan; wot
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To: Former Dodger
What keeps getting left out of the video is at the very end

I heard on the radio last night about parts of the video that isn't being airing by the MSM ...

I wasn't sure what the radio guy was talking about since I haven't seen the whole thing

41 posted on 11/19/2004 9:10:02 AM PST by Mo1 (Should be called Oil for Fraud and not Oil for Food)
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To: xzins

I agree with you. I don't know what this "deep propaganda" is called officially, but I do recognize it as part of a creeping and intentional effort to undermine our confidence in our troops and their commanders.

It might not seem like much now, but in ten or so months, after we've all been force fed day after day, we will see a real erosion of our current reverence for what our military does.

My message to everyone I talk to (and in my writing) is that our commanders from the top down are some of the best trained professionals our country has to offer. If they cannot do this job, NO ONE can do it. Faith and unwavering support are necessary, and we must fight the Fifth Column within (some of whom are aligned with our enemies) -- and not allow the propaganda to work.


42 posted on 11/19/2004 9:13:34 AM PST by campfollower (Marines break things and kill people. ..get over it!)
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To: IGOTMINE

WAR is Hell.

The military are catching it from the "We Hate America" groups both inside and outside of our country. If the enbedded reporters/photographers can't support the troops
they need to go!


43 posted on 11/19/2004 9:15:45 AM PST by Recall
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To: IGOTMINE

This is excellent !


44 posted on 11/19/2004 9:18:08 AM PST by kupia_kummi
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To: TheErnFormerlyKnownAsBig

It is time the U.S. Military opens up a "U.S.Jazeera" television station in the Middle East with an Arabic speaker countering the propaganda.

In this case, they could have shown how a Marine was blown up the day before by a booby-trapped corpse and explain that if the insurgents have a philosophy of suicide bombing and martrydom, it changes the way we have to treat surrendering prisoners.

Then we could have had a piece constrasting the barbaric Hassan murder with the shooting of a worthless insurgent who may or may not have been surrendering (you never know with martyrs).

Bush could do weekly addresses to the Arab world so they can get to know him better.

It should be a media war against Aljazeera ("All Jews We'll Kill Ya"). That is the only way we can win the hearts & minds of the sand maggots.


45 posted on 11/19/2004 9:19:10 AM PST by Jesse Jackster
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To: TheErnFormerlyKnownAsBig

It is time the U.S. Military opens up a "U.S.Jazeera" television station in the Middle East with an Arabic speaker countering the propaganda.

In this case, they could have shown how a Marine was blown up the day before by a booby-trapped corpse and explain that if the insurgents have a philosophy of suicide bombing and martrydom, it changes the way we have to treat surrendering prisoners.

Then we could have had a piece constrasting the barbaric Hassan murder with the shooting of a worthless insurgent who may or may not have been surrendering (you never know with martyrs).

Bush could do weekly addresses to the Arab world so they can get to know him better.

It should be a media war against Aljazeera ("All Jews We'll Kill Ya"). That is the only way we can win the hearts & minds of the sand maggots.


46 posted on 11/19/2004 9:19:12 AM PST by Jesse Jackster
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To: ProtectOurFreedom

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1283928/posts

You MUST hold the embedded reporter to account. I'm speaking as a journalist here, and I have seen them personally go in ITCHING for a controversy that would win them an award or set them apart from the pack.

See Dan Rather in Vietnam. This guy Sikes is trying for the same thing. He prides himself on being un-embedded. I'm not sure why he's with the Marines, unless they've just slacked off on requirements for embed status. (the initial guys had to go through an orientation)


47 posted on 11/19/2004 9:19:13 AM PST by campfollower (Marines break things and kill people. ..get over it!)
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To: Recall

Someone said it best here:

"It is better to be feared than respected..."

This is making more sense in the world today. I really don't care if the world thinks the US acts in its own self-interest (even though we're the most charitable nation in the world).

After all, the other countries ALWAYS have acted in their own self-interest, so why is the US held up to higher standards.


48 posted on 11/19/2004 9:23:30 AM PST by Jesse Jackster
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To: IGOTMINE

Here`s another example how the media is out to get our military; Last night while flipping through channels on the tube, I came to CBS, and correct me if I`m wrong, but they had a commercial for the TV show JAG, and I cold have sworn I heard them say "Soldiers abuse the prisoners. Will they get away with it?" And I was saying to myself, you have GOT to be freggin` kidding me!! They are STILL beating this story to death, and now that they can`t really put it on the news, let`s put it into a TV show!!


49 posted on 11/19/2004 9:28:36 AM PST by Imaverygooddriver (I`m a very good driver and I approve this message.)
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To: IGOTMINE
Some things have to be kept in mind while looking at that tape. The first, and most important, is that up until a few seconds earlier, the fertilizer was striking the oscillating air recirculator.

Most edits I've seen of the tape start after the Marines and the embedded reporter have entered the room. Did you notice the dust? Things had just been going BOOM in there. Further proof of this is seen in a closer examination of the two terrorists the reporter initially approaches to film. At this point, did you notice the guy on the right? He's got a nosebleed; and, since his shirt's not covered in blood, it had just started. The terrorists had just been subdued when that tape started.

They were fighting just seconds earlier. More importantly, they hadn't surrendered. Given a little time to recover from whatever the Marines had just tossed at them, these guys could have resumed their fight. They were not prisoners at this point. They were still enemy combatants.

The terrorist who got shot was either playing possum, as the Marine suspected, or he was just stunned. The Marine is under no obligation to assume the latter. What he saw was hostile activity on the part of the terrorist. He was well within his rights to defend himself and his unit. He may have made a mistake about what the other guy was doing, but a mistake is not a war crime.
50 posted on 11/19/2004 9:29:00 AM PST by Redcloak ("FOUR MORE BEERS! FOUR MORE BEERS! FOUR MORE BEERS!" -Teresa Heinz Kerry)
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To: ProtectOurFreedom
Compare & Contrast:
Kerry Silver Star report backs critics:
Confirms Democrat shot wounded enemy fighter as he fled

Excerpt: "Death is a reality of war. Events occur that are not for the faint of heart. Yet, John Kerry's account of killing what turned out to really be a wounded man while he fled continues Kerry's pattern of lies, exaggerations and embellishments. Killing a wounded man while he retreated from battle is not an action that most servicemen would brag about. But then again, most servicemen would not return home and attack the very country they were supposed to fight for."

* * *

Second example: The Sampan Incident

Excerpt: "On getting word of five dead VC at Kerry's hands with two more captured, Adm. Roy Hoffman sent his congratulations. "Upon learning of what Kerry had actually done," says O'Neill, "Hoffman recently expressed his contempt for Kerry as a liar, false warrior and fraud." As have other former Kerry commanders and comrades.

Where was the outrage during the Kerry campaign that is in evidence today? Is this what Democrats like Chris Matthews doing to improve their image among voters for 2006? If so, Bring It On!

51 posted on 11/19/2004 9:29:09 AM PST by OESY
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To: Mo1
Go to www.datter.com they have the video, ALL of it, and some other nest stuff.

If you understand Arabic, perhaos you will know what the wounded guy is saying to the camera.

52 posted on 11/19/2004 9:31:54 AM PST by Former Dodger ("False words are not only evil in themselves, but they infect the soul with evil. " - Plato)
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To: IGOTMINE

Dogs and cats living together BTTT.


53 posted on 11/19/2004 9:32:58 AM PST by spodefly (I've posted nothing but BTTT over 1000 times!!!)
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To: Former Dodger
If you understand Arabic, perhaos you will know what the wounded guy is saying to the camera.

I don't know Arabic ... and thank you for a link to the video

54 posted on 11/19/2004 9:48:03 AM PST by Mo1 (Should be called Oil for Fraud and not Oil for Food)
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To: IGOTMINE

Hmmm... When wounded, the bad guys often blow themselves up once our guys are close enough to take our guys with them. (All for the greater glory of their moon god, of course.)

This happens over and over. So, our guys have a few of their buddies killed, a few wounded, and learn the lesson: Bad guys who are wounded are VERY dangerous.

So what do you do? You kill the bad guys if they even blink wrong. You have no choice. Sometimes you are right, sometimes you are wrong, but so what? YOU HAD NO CHOICE!

This is basic common sense, even to the MSM. That they refuse to admit it tells us everything we need to know: The MSM is also the enemy. (as if we did not already know...)

Which, of course, gets us back to Mr. Sites. The man is an enemy of the U.S.

Personally, I would like to see him exchanged for some poor hostage somewhere. He can then go on TV and beg for his life, just before they cut off his head. He can condemn the soldiers who are placing their lives on the line to protect us from the monsters who are about to cut off his head, and then he can die.


55 posted on 11/19/2004 9:49:47 AM PST by EternalHope (Boycott everything French forever. Including their vassal nations.)
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To: NormsRevenge
This photo was the beginning of the end in Vietnam, the MSM are hoping for a similar result.


56 posted on 11/19/2004 9:58:29 AM PST by itsahoot (Sometimes the truth hurts, sometimes it makes a difference, but not often.)
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To: Imaverygooddriver

It says in the blurb that JAG defends 3 MP's charged with abusing prisoners at Gitmo.

JAG usually takes a pro position on all our military guys, and they have a new 2 star Marine AS JAG Commander, so I will wait and see how it plays out. RAB once successfully defended a hot shot pilot, but then handed him his head for being a smart ass hot shot. I can always change the channel.


57 posted on 11/19/2004 10:11:19 AM PST by itsahoot (Sometimes the truth hurts, sometimes it makes a difference, but not often.)
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To: IGOTMINE

Strange how silent the embedded reporter was, and his camera unused the day before this incidence when one of those dead insurgents blew himself up and killed several marines. Those who photograph and report only half the truth, are in fact nothing but damn liars.

If this embedded piece of dog shit is the best our MSM has to offer, we need to drop kick their asses through the goal post of rationality.

The MSM of our enemies are reporting with less bias than our own.


58 posted on 11/19/2004 10:12:15 AM PST by F.J. Mitchell (Specter promises not to block Bush appointees, yippee! but will he nuke barriers erected by JC Dems?)
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Comment #59 Removed by Moderator

To: Fyscat

"Maybe for Fort Ord."

Care to elaborate on that statement before I fire up my flame thrower?


60 posted on 11/19/2004 10:16:40 AM PST by F.J. Mitchell (Specter promises not to block Bush appointees, yippee! but will he nuke barriers erected by JC Dems?)
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