[clee1]

Monty's defeat of Rommel was nothing short of brilliant, although I have to reconsider him as part of the "Greatest" list.

Schwartzkopfs envelopment and distruction of a large modern army in such a short time will go down in history as one of the greatest military actions of all time; comparable to D-Day, Shermans March, etc.

Franks, while I respect him tremendously, fought two pi$$-ant enemies with overwhelming force. A 15 year old paintball-battle-fighter could have done as well.

[MagnumRancid]

<<
Monty's defeat of Rommel was nothing short of brilliant, although I have to reconsider him as part of the "Greatest" list.
>>
Sometimes I wonder if perhaps Rommel is one of the more over rated generals. By the time Monty got involved Rommel's lines of supply and reenforcement had been well interdicted. Monty's ability may have well hastened the process but Rommel's defeat was only a matter of time.

[HerrKobes]

Franks, while I respect him tremendously, fought two pi$$-ant enemies with overwhelming force

A guy I know took part in the initial invasion and liberation of Iraq and had some choice words on Franks.

He helped coordinate air support between troops in contact and USAF/USN aircraft at the CAOC (Coalition Air Operations Center), and said Franks not only openly maligned the air services but also created an atmosphere where the Army leadership in the campaign sought to avoid USAF/USN air support by seeking any alternative, even if air support would be more appropriate than artillery based on target type and response time.

[dougd]

Monty's defeat of Rommel was nothing short of brilliant, although I have to reconsider him as part of the "Greatest" list.

Schwartzkopfs envelopment and distruction of a large modern army in such a short time will go down in history as one of the greatest military actions of all time; comparable to D-Day, Shermans March, etc.

Franks, while I respect him tremendously, fought two pi$$-ant enemies with overwhelming force. A 15 year old paintball-battle-fighter could have done as well.

Monty's defeat of Rommel was almost entirely due to enigma intercepts. He knew virtually everything. Hard to lose when you get to see your opponents hand.

Schwartzkopf, I think, merely benefitted from a technological advantage with rather pedestrian tactics. Plus, if you include the months of aerial bombing preceding the ground war, it was hardly either a rapid engagement, nor a terribly large modern army by that time.

Franks too had technological advantages, however his enemies were hardly pissant - the first having defeated the Russians and every would be invader since Alexander; and the second only defeated outside their boundaries in a relatively small invaded area. Moreover, Franks had to accomplish his victories at incredible numerical disadvantage of 'boots on the ground'. His war plans truly achieved force multiplication by creative use of both his technological superiority, speed of operation and inherent flexibility.

[Rockingham]

Schwartzkopf's envelopment of the Iraqi Army was not his idea but came from a retired Air Force Colonel named John Boyd, who, living in Boynton Beach discerned and critiqued Schwartzkopf's plan. Boyd then got through to allies in the Pentagon -- including Secretary of Defense Dick Cheney. Schwartzkopf was furious at what he saw as meddling but in time saw the wisdom of the "end run" that Boyd had proposed. Take a look at the book Boyd, by Roger Coram, for the details of a remarkable and tempestuous military career.

[normy]

Franks, while I respect him tremendously, fought two pi$$-ant enemies with overwhelming force. A 15 year old paintball-battle-fighter could have done as well.

Tactically speaking, if Franks would have followed the advice of some of our esteemed Senators and flooded the country with troops, not using the Northern Alliance fighters and putting a local face on the fight, I believe it would have taken much longer, possibly similar to the Russians. If Franks would have listened to some of the Monday morning QB's in Iraq, we would have fought Somalia style and it would have taken months to take Baghdad, perhaps losing thousands just to take it. Iraq and Afghanistan could have been ugly disasters.

[kidd]

I gotta agree with Schwartzkopf.

Pulled off a sneak attack despite modern day equipment (radar/satelites/hostile locals with cell phones, etc). Fooled the press and used them to his benefit.

Established air superiority. Pulled off a logistical miracle.

[luvbach1]

Can't fault Franks for applying overwhelming force. It was a strategy that won handily and spared his troops. A good parlay. And remember, critics at the time said we did not have enough troops and materiel for the task. Of course, not referring to the aftermath in Iraq.