[GarySpFc]

By the way, when speaking of civilizational level, I was not referring to educational attainments either.

Why not? I agree there is more to being civilized than ones educational level, however it cannot be overlooked. You neglected to mention I also stated I see Russians as more sophisticated and highly cultured than Americans. Are those not aspects of civilized behavior?

[GSlob]

Judging by the kind of society the Russians have been able to create for themselves and occasionally export to others (like the Baltics- since 1700's) these aspects, if they have ever been there, are not sufficient. The best description I ever came across of the social characteristics I am talking about, comes in Russian proverb
"Ty nachal'nik - ya der'mo, ya nachal'nik - ty der'mo" - "If you're the boss, I'm POS,if I'm the boss - you're POS". Now tell me what, if any, improvement would occur in such a system if that same arbitrary boss is sophisticated and cultured?