Keyes, Obama face off on faith, fundamentals

The Daily Northwestern ^ | October 22, 2004 | By Shira Toeplitz

[EternalVigilance]

Alan was making a direct bid for the black vote with his iteration and reiteration of the truth about how disproportionately abortion affects the black community...as per racist Margaret Sanger's (the founder of Planned no-Parenthood) plan.

Most of the media committed a severe sin of omission by not reporting on this part of the debate today. Not hard to figure out why.

This is one of the few articles that did not.

Great post!

[Jim Robinson]

Actually, Keyes had quite a bit to say in the defense of the Constitution and his support of our rights to keep and bear arms. The reporter picked out a brief soundbite out of a two minute statement, failing to mention the rest of Keyes' Constitutional rights argument.

There is a link to the audio file of this debate on the front page of Renew America:

http://www.renewamerica.us/

I recommend listening to the entire debate, but you may look for the two minute second amendment portion starting at 13:45 here:

http://www.renewamerica.us/archives/speeches/audio/10_21_2004debate2.mp3

[Jim Robinson]

"Law abiding citizens should have a right to bear arms," he said."

In the full sentence that this soundbite was extracted from Keyes actually said:

"I will state boldly though, that I am a supporter of the second amendment and believe strongly that law abiding citizens should have their right to keep and bear arms left in tact."

But you need to listen to the full argument.

[Jim Robinson]

Great! EternalVigilance just posted a full transcript of the debate here:

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1253974/posts

Here's the second amendment portion and rebuttals:

ANDY SHAW, ABC-CHANNEL 7 REPORTER: Mr. Keyes, you shocked a lot of people a month ago when you said that law-abiding citizens trained in gun safety should be allowed to carry machine guns on the streets of cities like Chicago. Explain that, if you will.

KEYES: Well, actually, as you know, Andy, I never said that. I was asked a question about whether or not people should have access, under our Constitution and laws, to automatic weapons, and I referred the reporter to the factual situation--that, in fact, under our Constitution and laws, such access is allowed.

I will state boldly, though, that I am a supporter of the Second Amendment, and I believe strongly that law-abiding citizens should have their right to keep and bear arms left intact.

The gun control mentality is ruthlessly absurd. It suggests that you pass a law which will bind law-abiding citizens. They won't have access to weapons. Now, we know that criminals, by definition, are people who don't obey laws. Therefore, you can pass all the laws that you want. They will still have access to these weapons, just as they have access to illegal drugs and other things right now. That means you end up with a situation in which the law-abiding folks can't defend themselves, and the crooks have all the guns.

Happy enough, I guess, for Senator Obama, since he doesn't believe that homeowners should be able to defend themselves if their house is broken into. He voted against a bill that would have allowed that self-defense to be a plea against the charge that you were in illegal possession of a firearm.

But, no! That's not good enough. But he wants the crooks to get warning from the police, if they are breaking into a place where they know armed criminals are waiting, he wants to make sure that they give them fair warning, so I guess they can shoot the police to death.

I don't believe in arming the criminals and protecting the criminal, while leaving the law-abiding citizens disarmed, and telling our police that they must work under every disadvantage. That doesn't serve order. It doesn't serve law. And it doesn't make sense.

MAGERS: Mr. Obama.

OBAMA: Well, let's be clear. Mr. Keyes, for example, does not believe in common gun safety laws like the assault weapons bill. I have, as one of my guests today, the head of the Fraternal Order of Police. I'm proud of the support that I've received from that organization, in part, because they are concerned precisely about what Mr. Keyes referred to--getting shot by assault weapons, when they go in, in an attempt to do a drug bust.

Now, Mr. Keyes suggested that, somehow, because criminals break the law, that we shouldn't have laws in the first place. That defies logic. People break all sorts of laws, but we still have the laws in place.

And the fact of the matter is, is that Mr. Keyes does not believe in any limits, that I can tell, with respect to the possession of guns, including assault weapons that have only one purpose, and that is to kill people, unless you're seeing a lot of deer out there wearing bullet-proof vests, then there is no purpose for many of the guns.

I think it is a scandal that this president did not force a renewal of this assault weapons ban. If it had problems with it, then we should have closed those loopholes that might have made it not as effective as it should have been.

MAGERS: Thank you very much, Mr. Obama, and Mr. Keyes, you have thirty seconds to rebut.

KEYES: I think one of the great problems is that the Assault Weapons Ban deals with a fictional distinction. You have guns that are exactly the same guns as are banned, in function, that were banned because of the way they look. And you know, that's the whole truth of this policy: it's to make politicians look as if they are doing something, when in point of fact, they are doing nothing.

The answer to crime is not gun control, it is law enforcement and self-control. And when we remember that, we will see the rates of crime go down in Chicago, and everywhere else.

MAGERS: Mr. Obama, thirty seconds.

OBAMA: Well, I think it's true that we have to focus on self-control, and when young gang-bangers are out there shooting into crowds, there's a moral issue and a values issue that has to be addressed.

But I tell you what, it helps if they don't have an assault weapon with them when they shoot into that crowd. And I think that common sense gun safety laws aren't just supported by gun control politicians. They're supported by mothers who've been, seen their loved ones gunned down on the streets, and I think it's necessary that we address the problems that they see every day.

[Paperdoll]

You can contribute to Dr. Alan Keye's campaign at:

Renew America
819 Virginia Ave. SE
Washington D.C. 20003

[Paperdoll]

You can contribute to Dr. Alan Keye's campaign at:

Renew America
819 Virginia Ave. SE
Washington D.C. 20003

[saradippity]

I just pray that Alan keeps speaking truth and that God removes the blinders and ear plugs from those who wear them inadvertantly.

And while God's at it,perhaps He could mute the voices of those given to vicious diatribes against Alan and quell the ferocity of the written attacks other anti-Keyes people make.

And,if God has any time left,I wish He could tell me what motivates so many,who claim to be conservative and appear reasonably smart,to inundate the airways,cyberspace and the visual media with an unrelenting barrage of smarmy,snide,ugly comments that strike each other as witty and clever and worthy of oh-so-cute little high-fives.

Almost as bad,but not quite,are the transparent "I am just so worried that he will hurt the party,or Bush,or the cause,or himself,or his family or,or,or".

Finally,I have no problem with comments concerning not liking his style,position on taxes, reparations or coming into a state he did not reside in,or even the one's who initially thought he had attacked someone's daughter. However,when it is repeated numerous times on every thread it gets pretty tiresome,then maybe to relieve boredom,it excalates and threads with interesting and valuable information get pulled for abuse.

I would say Keyes supporters should pull back when the usual "gang" start the usual "bang". Lurkers who are searching can't help but see who's doing what to whom that way.

[k2blader]

Thanks for the links, Jim. I'm planning to watch the video this weekend.

I was listening to the debate live and heard most of Keyes' excellent defense.

[anniegetyourgun]

Ah, the power of the entire statement seems always to be missing in written accounts.