Russian Sukhoi fighters sell well

http://www.flug-revue.rotor.com/ ^ | 18-10-04

[sukhoi-30mki]

Ping!!!

[finnman69]

http://www.globalsecurity.org/military/world/russia/su-27.htm

http://www.globalsecurity.org/military/world/russia/su-30mk.htm

[Oblongata]

You have to admit, they both are beautiful airplanes.

[fooman]

with thrust vectoring, I wonder how well these will do against the F22

[Oblongata]

"with thrust vectoring, I wonder how well these will do against the F22"

If they can see the F22.

[madvlad]

I have had running discussions (arguments)
w/ a Russian in my lab. He conceded that
Russia does as the US does in terms of selling
slightly (or greatly) watered down versions
of the top of the line weapons systems to
'allies' or other customers.

Can anybody confirm the veracity of the source
or even the actual occurrence of the exercise
w/ India?

MV

MV

[Steelerfan]

Here is one thread on it. http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1237790/posts

There have been several and a lot of debate about whether the results have been spun to support the AF's case for buying the F-22.

Hope this helps.

[sukhoi-30mki]

Only one operational variant,the SU-30MKI of the Indian airforce has thrust vectoring now & you don't have to worry bout them taking on the US for the foreseeable future.Besides the Su-30/35 doesn't have supercruise(ability to travel supersonic without the afterburner) unlike the F/A-22,so that's a big disadvantage.The F/A-22 is far more stealthier & has a better radar.& should we get started on the AWACS,Electronic warfare systems etc?

[PAR35]

The F-22 should be far superior to the SU, but the SU is competitive with anything else out there, and the Russians will make deals to move them off the lot.

[PAR35]

Can anybody confirm the veracity of the source or even the actual occurrence of the exercise w/ India?

The exercises were widely reported at the time. There were suggestions that the rules of the exercise favored the Indians.

[sukhoi-30mki]

Actually the Russians do sell 'toned down' systems to countries like China & Iran-folks it can't trust fully.But for India,the criteria is different as India has always been close to the Russians & is also a counterweight to China.India has always got access to the best of Russian military hardware & a perfect example is the SU-30s in it's airforce which also have French & Israeli systems added to it.Infact the Russians have sold India systems like the 'Klub' anti-ship/land attack cruise missile even before it entered Russian service(due to lack of funds).The Russians cannot afford to be choosy when it comes to selling what they want,unlike the Americans due to their dire economic situation.Moreover ,foreign armsales,primarily to China & India are infact one of the main sources of subsidising new purchases for the Russian military.

[PAR35]

He conceded that Russia does as the US does in terms of selling slightly (or greatly) watered down versions of the top of the line weapons systems to 'allies' or other customers.

The Indian planes may actually be superior to the Russian version, as the Indians upgrade weapon systems with French, Israeli, and indigenous technology.

[AppyPappy]

And they have never served in combat against other planes.

[sukhoi-30mki]

Well they had to favour the Indians as that would be the only way to realistically simulate what US forces would face if they are going to engage in a war over the Taiwan straits.China also uses the Su-27/30(though inferior to Indian variants) & the fact that they also are inducting force multipliers like the A-50 AWACS means that we cannot expect onesided conflicts like in the Gulf-war of 91(though the US is ofcourse miles ahead of the PLAAF).

[abadger]

Aviation Week had a writeup on the Indian wargame exercise last week. It pitted 6 USAF F-15Cs against about 18 Indian planes. In addition the USAF planes did not have the new AESA radars now entering service so they weren't our top of the line planes. Also, the rules of engagement did not allow the US planes to fire long range missiles farther than 20 miles. This negated many advantages the US would have had.

That being said the US pilots gave a lot of credit to the Indian pilots and said they used good tactics.

[sukhoi-30mki]

Actually the SU-27 has served in combat.I was reading up on the Ethiopia-Eritria conflict of 1999-2000 the other day & realised it was a pretty major war(Which most of us folks infact didn't even hear about) with stuff like the SU-27,Mig-29 etc.The Ethiopian airforce had a few SU-27s ,freshly delivered from the Russians & some were flown by Russian pilots(some rumours say that a lot of Ethiopian stuff was upgraded by Israel).The SU-27s shoot down infact 3-4 Eritrian Mig-29s & a few helicopters(if im not mistaken).The biggest surprise of the lot is that this conflict reportedly produced something that the USAF or the Israeli AF hasn't done-the first Female ACE!!An Ethiopian airforce female pilot ,flying an SU-27 shot down a Mig-29 ,which was ironically flown by her ex instructor(Before Eritria broke away).

& I believe I have told you about the case of Indian Mig-29s scaring the living daylights out of 2 Pakistani F-16s during the Kargil war of 1999.

[PAR35]

Thanks for the additonal info. I thought I remembered the numerical disparity, but I was hazy on the details. And, if (when) we face off against China, I would expect them to have the advantage of numbers.

[Joe 6-pack]

[abadger]

No doubt that is a very beautiful airplane. Wow nice pic!