No WMD Stockpiles in Iraq? Not Exactly

NewsMax.com ^ | 10/08/04 | Carl Limbacher and NewsMax.com Staff

[Prost1]

Is it really true that Saddam Hussein had no "stockpiles" of weapons of mass destruction before the U.S. invaded in March 2003?

Not exactly - at least not if one counts the 500 tons of uranium that the Iraqi dictator kept stored at his al Tuwaitha nuclear weapons development plant.

[Fred Fighter]

You wrote:

"before I get hammered I put my period in the wrong place. It should be 1.8 tons of weaponized material not 18 like I stated."

And it is still untrue.

--

FF

[Pres Raygun]

Why did Saddam have 500 tons of yellowcake in the first place if not for the purposes of developing a nuclear weapon? His Nuclear Power Plant was bombed by the Israelis and I don't think he ever tried to rebuild it. And why would Iraq with its enormous oil reserves and abundant hydroelectric power generation system have any need for nuclear power in the first place? Regardless of whether Saddam had the means to enrich his 500 tons of yellowcake or not, we obviously had no way of knowing what he capabilities were. We did the right thing and I wish Clinton had done at least bombed North Korea before they developed the bomb.

[Carl/NewsMax]

The IAEA had Saddam's nuclear facilities under control?

Not according to this report:

Associated Press Worldstream

October 01, 1999; Friday 14:47 Eastern Time

HEADLINE: Iraq, North Korea urged to comply with nuclear weapons inspectors

DATELINE: VIENNA, Austria

Iraq and North Korea came under fire Friday for failing to cooperate with nuclear weapons inspectors, while Israel was accused by its Middle Eastern neighbors of blocking efforts to create a nuclear weapon free zone in the region.

At the International Atomic Energy Agency's 43rd annual meeting, representatives from more than 100 countries urged Iraq and North Korea to comply with agreements allowing the United Nations' nuclear watchdog agency to inspect the nuclear programs of the two nations.

Iraq has been accused of blocking access to documents and possible nuclear sites, and the IAEA has been unable to conduct inspections since December.

Iraqi officials have repeatedly argued that they have fulfilled their obligations, and sanctions imposed by the U.N. Security Council at the end of the Gulf War should be lifted.

However, U.S. representative John B. Ritch III said, ''Iraq is challenging the will of the Security Council. Iraq is solely responsible for the present situation.''

[SNIP]

Criticism also was leveled at North Korea for failing to grant IAEA inspectors access to a suspected underground nuclear site.

International officials also fear North Korea may be destroying information about its nuclear program.

[Fred Fighter]

Did you consider reading the 1997 IAEA report?


a. Low enriched uranium

In 1982 Iraq imported from Italy 1,767 kg of uranium enriched to 2.6% in U-235 in the form of UO2 powder. The material has been verified and fully accounted for and remains in Iraq, under the control of the IAEA, at Location C (a storage complex close to Tuwaitha), in the same form as it was received. "

I provided the link, here it is again:

http://www.iraqwatch.org/un/IAEA/s-1997-779-att-1.htm

IIRC, 2.6% U-235 is about right for reactor fuel rods
and is a long ways short of weapons grade.

Here, you can read up on the UNSCOM, UNMOVIC and
IAEA reports:

http://www.iraqwatch.org/un/

It is far from being the only place to find them online.
In this day and age what excuse can anyone posibly have
for not checking the UN reports on Iraqi WMD programs
befor writing about them?

--

FF

[R. Scott]

Is there ANYTHING that will ever be enough "proof" for you?

“Proof” would have to consist of several warehouses full of weaponized (loaded into shells, mines and bombs ready to go) poison gas, biological agents and nuclear weapons. All would have to be clearly labeled in Arabic, French and English “Weapons of Mass Destruction” and have Saddam’s signature on each one. Each would have to have a clear manufacturing date to show they were made after Operation Desert Storm.

[Fred Fighter]

You wrote

"Why did Saddam have 500 tons of yellowcake in
the first place if not for the purposes of developing
a nuclear weapon? His Nuclear Power Plant was bombed
by the Israelis and I don't think he ever tried to
rebuild it.
...

We rebombed it in 1991 and also bombed the new
one the Russians were building for him. But
I digress.

Did you even consider reading the IAEA report at
the link I provided?

Here's an exerp:

"The yellowcake procured from Portugal was supplied in two
batches. Batch 1, received on 20 June 1980, consisted of
429 drums containing 138,098 kg of yellowcake and batch
two, received as three consignments over the period from
17 May 1982 through 20 June 1982, consisted of 487 drums
containing 148,348 kg yellow cake.
...
The yellowcake procured from Niger was also shipped in two
batches. Batch one, received on 8 February 1981, consisted
of 432 drums containing 137,435 kg of yellowcake and batch
two, received on 18 March 1982, consisted of 426 drums
containing 139,409 kg yellowcake. "

Note the dates.

Of course Saddam Hussein wanted to make nuclear weapons,
no one ever denied that. There is no question that he
had an active nuclear weapons program prior to 1991.

I don't doubt that he would have restarted it if he could
have and don't know any one who has such a doubt.

--

FF

[txradioguy]

How can it be untrue when it's in the report quoted in the NesMax article?

Talk about not taking the blinders off!

Oh wait I get it...I've discussed this matter with your type before...anything short of a nuclear detonation that can be traced back to Iraq will EVER convince you that Iraq had WMD's.

I shoulda known.

[Cyclone59]

500 tons, no, no, no. Now if you were in Germany, 500 tons would be a stockpile, but were not.

Paraphrasing one of the two GOOD things to come out of Canada - Red Green Show being the other.

[txradioguy]

Steer clear of Fred Fighter. His line of discussion on this topic is designed to stir the pot and cause an instant argument with everyone who posts here.

NOTHING any of us say to him will sway him...even a sworn statement by Saddam himself wouldn't make him budge from his thinking that he knows better than we about this issue.

Argue with him if you dare...but don't say I didn't warn you.

And no FF I'm not saying this becasue I can't show you where you're wrong in your thingking...hell what do I know...I only spent year over there anyway. Life is just too short to argue with a brick wall.

[knews_hound]

Note his signup date as well......

Has troll written all over it.


Cheers,

knews hound

[Pres Raygun]

I don't doubt that he would have restarted it if he could have and don't know any one who has such a doubt.

Well said. Combine the above with the fact that Saddam was using the Oil for Food Program to bypass or dismantle the sanctions and the fact that he would not cooperate with the rest of the world in apprehending terrorists within Iraq and any sane person would rightfully conclude that he needed to be removed from power. Thank God for President Bush and his leadership.

[Fred Fighter]

You wrote:

"How can it be untrue when it's in the report quoted in the NesMax article?"

1) A number of people are quoted in the newsMax article,
however I do not see where any specific report is cited.
So I have no way to identify the report to which you refer.

2) You said they found 1.8 tons of 'weaponized' uranium
in Iraq. That claim did not come from the NewsMax article.
There is an incorrect statement in the NewsMax article
about 1.8 tons of uranium 'Saddam had started to
enrich.'

3) That claim was incorrect because the material in
question had been enriched outside of Iraq as shown
in the IAEA report I cited. Also, as shown in the IAEA
report I cited, it had been secured by the IAEA since
some time shortly after the 1991 war.

There is no doubt that Iraq had WMDs. That doesn't
change the fact that the NewsMax article is a product
of some combination of ignorance and dishonesty, sort
of like Rush Limbaugh, but less entertaining.

--

FF

[rock58seg]

It should be 1.8 tons of weaponized material not 18 like I stated.

35 pounds, I repeat, 35 pounds, was always considered a critical mass, when I was undergoing CBR training in the service. Critical mass is the amount needed for a low grade bomb.

BUSH/CHENEY IN 20004!

[txradioguy]

Begone Troll


May you get ZOTTED early and often.

[Fred Fighter]

You wrote:

"35 pounds, I repeat, 35 pounds, was always considered a critical mass, when I was undergoing CBR training in the service. Critical mass is the amount needed for a low grade bomb."

Agreed. What did your DBR training tell you about the
degree of enrichment needed to convert natural Uranium
to fissile (weapons grade) material?

Not even NewsMax claims that 35 pounds of weapons grade
U-235 was found in Iraq. That was a fabrication by
txradioguy.

Don't trust me! Read the NewsMax artilce for yourselves.

Then go read the IAEA reports. In 1981 or 1982 Iraq bought
1.7x tons of slightly enriched Uranium (2.6% U-235) from
Italy. That material had been stored in Iraq under the
supervision of IAEA from 1994 to 1999. In 2003 the IAEA
re-inventoried it and confirmed that it was still stored
under the IAEA seals. That is NOT weapons grade material.

That is reactor fuel material.

Don't trust me! Read the IAEA reports for yourselves.

--

FF

[Fred Fighter]

The IAEA had Saddam's nuclear facilities under control?

Not according to this report:

Associated Press Worldstream

October 01, 1999; Friday 14:47 Eastern Time

Indeed between 1999 when IAEA and UNMOVIC inspectors left Iraq until 2002 when they returned there was much to be concerned about.

Happily, IAEA was able to confirm that the nuclear materials, including approximately 500 tons of yellowcake and 1.8 tons of _slightly_ enriched Uranium were still under seal upon re inspection in 2002-2003.

After Tuwaitha was vandalized, during the several weeks that the US left it unguarded following the end to major military operations, it was revisited by IAEA who assisted in the cleanup. All but a small about (12 kg, IIRC) of the yellowcake was recovered. It seems that the barrels of yellowcake were stolen for the barrels the yellowcake itself was dumped out at Tuwaitha.

--

FF