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Don’t Shoot the Messenger . . ’cause this assessment’s grim
National Review ^ | 10/01/04 | Jay Nordlinger

Posted on 09/30/2004 10:35:23 PM PDT by Pokey78

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To: frank-the-tank
All I heard about his "plan" was that it had four points. Anyone ever catch what even one of those points might be? Based on what I heard they are:
201 posted on 10/01/2004 3:47:56 AM PDT by Hawkeye
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To: wtc911; omstrat

I would have preferred that the President made these points during the debates. However, there is nothing preventing him, the Vice president, and others, from making them now, and again and again, until the election. Another way to look at it is that the President is being criticized not for what he said, but for what he didn't say. Kerry, on the other hand, will be criticized for what he DID say. He has finally spoken and his words will take him down. Do not depair; do not lose faith.


202 posted on 10/01/2004 3:55:31 AM PDT by Pharlap
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To: wtc911
Look, I am going to agree that one of the things that THEY should have practiced is back and forth give and take with Bush - and not the canned speach stuff. Bush does need to keep short notes as Kerry talks about factual and other errors that he needs to address. Kerry's MO is pretty well established by this point and so Bush's preparation team should have done better with him. Everyone knows it is not his strong point, and his team should have been practicing with him starting about 2 years ago. A little bit of practice every other week would have gone a long long way.

Of course, Bush is a busy President and probably doesn't have time for a lot of useless activities like this.

203 posted on 10/01/2004 4:02:22 AM PDT by AndyJackson
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To: Pharlap
I've posted that I do not believe that W. lost the election, just the chance to nail it down. Last night should have been the moment when the Fat Lady sings, now we've got to go out and keep at it.

Side bar...did asnyone else hear Kerry say we need to flatten Fallujah?

204 posted on 10/01/2004 4:03:00 AM PDT by wtc911 (I have half a Snickers...it was given to me by a CIA guy as we went into Cambodia)
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To: Pokey78
This article best reflects what I felt at the end of the debate. Sort of a "Too bad, he could have knocked this out of the park and did not."
205 posted on 10/01/2004 4:06:09 AM PDT by Lloyd227 (American Forces armed with what? Spit balls?)
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To: AndyJackson

I am pleased and surprised by the take on Imus this morning. I guess I expected Bush to nail Kerry's coffin shut and I'm peeved that it didn't happen.


206 posted on 10/01/2004 4:06:31 AM PDT by wtc911 (I have half a Snickers...it was given to me by a CIA guy as we went into Cambodia)
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To: MNJohnnie

"Yet another supposed Republican so hung up on style he missed the substance. "

Yep. The truth is that ALL pundits, right and left, have more in common with each other than any of them do with the rest of us (possible exception is Mark Steyn.) They're all that east coast Ivy League elitist mentality (even if some, like Nordlinger here, technically didn't attend an Ivy League.) Steyn didn't finish college-- he's basically self-educated-- which is what, I think, makes him different.

And yes, I think this debate definitely helped Bush with women. Kerry came across as a pompous ass, not a nice guy, while Bush came across as sincere, steady & reliable, a guy you can count on. Women may date Kerry, but they'll marry Bush. ;) (Also, I don't think sounding a bit defensive hurts Bush with women, just makes Kerry seem like more of a butt.)


207 posted on 10/01/2004 4:10:31 AM PDT by walden
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To: Pokey78
Visually Bush was not at his best tonight but an analysis based on appearance is shallow. Appearance is important but substance is what counts.

While President Bush was out surveying the damage done by the recent hurricanes and comforting people today, Kerry was in a plush room getting a manicure and painting himself orange. So President Bush was tired tonight because he cares more about people than himself. On the other hand, Kerry only has to focus on one goal - the presidency. President Bush, in addition to campaigning for re-election, has the world on his shoulders and he handles himself with dignity and grace in spite of all the demands.

I'll take George W. Bush on his worst day over John Effin Kerry at his best - which appears to be when he's putting down the country that he wants to be president of.

208 posted on 10/01/2004 4:11:10 AM PDT by slimer
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To: Visioneer
No, actually he was at his peak several hours earlier while he was comforting the hurricane-ravaged people of Florida... Frankls, I thought President Bush did extremely well tonight...considering the level of physical exhaustion he had to be contending with....

Well, er good. But he had to be a comforting factor to a nation that has been hit hard with the the remenants of the storms as they finished themselves out in the East mountain regions. He needed to comfort those who still feel edgy about jobs and the economy. He needed to show comfort to those who worry about whether Iraq is on course or we got sideswiped.

He showed amazing endurance on 9/11. It was one of his shining moments. He didn't show fatigue. And that devesation was much worse than Florida. It 9/11was created by an enemy. The threat was ongoing. Why was his endurance so strong on 9/11 and so failing on 9/30.

209 posted on 10/01/2004 4:29:23 AM PDT by joesbucks
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To: Pokey78
IMHO

Senator Kerry's "Net" message was, President Bush does not know what he is doing .

President Bush's "Net" message was, I will continue to take the fight to the terrorists .

President Bush won !
210 posted on 10/01/2004 4:29:57 AM PDT by SC oops (Myrtle Beach, Charleston, Hilton Head . SC rules)
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To: jwalsh07
Think global test, providing Iran nuclear fuel, unilateral disaramament of our bunker busting program, no forward basing in Iraq, bilateral talks with Korea etc, etc.

Those sound bites are going to become GOP commercials.

211 posted on 10/01/2004 4:32:19 AM PDT by Poohbah (If you're not living on the edge, you're taking up too much room.)
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To: Pokey78

I don't have time to write up a substantive analysis, but here is my superficial appearance analysis:

Kerry came across as polished as his shiny white teeth, his over-made up, botoxed face and his finely manicured hands. His practiced smile made him look like he was on a toothpaste commercial. In the first half hour, he was generally able to control his pointing and hand gestures, but by the end they were on full display. Kerry's botox kept him appearing calm throughout. With Kerry, it is all about appearances, in every sense of the word.

President Bush looked more like a real, live person. He "lives" in his face, with all his various facial expressions. He seems real when he speaks. He particularly cannot hide it when he is annoyed; he has no botox to keep it off his face. The President definitely was annoyed by Kerry's concerted tearing down of our war effort. You could tell by just looking at the President that he truly believes that he is doing what is best for our country.


212 posted on 10/01/2004 4:35:23 AM PDT by itsnevertoolate
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To: Pokey78

I hate to admit it, but I thought Kerry was more articulate and won on "style" points. Bush seemed sincere and passionate in defending his positions, but the President also looked tired at times. I understand GWB spent a good part of the day consoling hurricane victims...perhaps he was emotionally drained from the day.

At any rate, no clear knockout, no major gaffes, so I don't really expect any major movement of voters to Kerry. Hope Bush can get his "A" game back before the next debate.


213 posted on 10/01/2004 4:39:36 AM PDT by IndyTiger
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To: demnomo
To: JLS The problem for Kerry may well be his mistake on the NYC subway system. That could dominate the debate coverage.

This story should be on the front page of the New York Post tomorrow morning.

What about the NYC subway system? I am not up on this. TY for the answer.

214 posted on 10/01/2004 5:10:01 AM PDT by Bellflower (A new day is coming!)
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To: Bellflower

During the debate, Kerry made some claim that the NY Subway was shut down for the Republican Convention--proof positive that President Bush can't "protect" the city from terrorists. The fact is that the subway was NOT shut down.

Kerry made a lot more gaffes--and LIES--than that, including the one about him never saying that Bush or the Administration had "LIED" about anything.

When Bush has former Mayor--and major lefty--Ed Koch in his camp because Ed knows dang well who will be tougher and consistant on terrorism in the long run, Kerry should have known better than to say this.


215 posted on 10/01/2004 8:17:11 AM PDT by demnomo (Bush is all hot in a flight suit. Kerry is all wet in a wet suit.)
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To: California Patriot
Your post is extremely unfair

Perhaps.....Perhaps not.

I am tired of fair weather supporters on this forum who have advocated everything from dumping Cheney to replacing Colin Powell whenever some little hiccup occurs.

I note those hiccups are all the result of MSM spin or statements by Constitution Party zealots who pretend to be level headed but are really just bloviating.

If I misread your criticism then I apologize for my tone

We all saw the same debate. I was pleased the president did not make any major gaffs and held his own.

I was pleased and understood that he had worked a full day and was in a rat packed auditorium in Shalala's private pig sty and had the most insulting piece of garbage on the planet within feet of him pretending to be a statesman as he derided our troops once more and said treasonous things to win the White House for his group of monkeys.

But, it is a new day this morning and I have calmed down a bit:-)

216 posted on 10/01/2004 9:09:36 AM PDT by Cold Heat (http://ice.he.net/~freepnet/kerry/staticpages/index.php?page=20040531140357545)
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To: omstrat

Yep. It makes you wonder how many other stupid mistakes these geniuses will make. It is so obvious that it also makes me question the president's political judgement.


217 posted on 10/01/2004 9:37:41 AM PDT by California Patriot (California Patriot)
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To: Cold Heat

But he had no business "working a full day" before a debate. When there's a debate coming up, his job IS
to be prepared for it in every way.

He absolutely had no business wearing himself out with
a lengthy "compassion" visit with hurricane victims.
Bush let us all down last night, and yesterday.


218 posted on 10/01/2004 9:39:12 AM PDT by California Patriot (California Patriot)
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To: Pokey78
He didn't watch it on TV.

How do I know? No mention of the Kerry hand gestures.

219 posted on 10/01/2004 9:41:15 AM PDT by AmishDude
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To: California Patriot
But he had no business "working a full day" before a debate. When there's a debate coming up, his job IS to be prepared for it in every way. He absolutely had no business wearing himself out with a lengthy "compassion" visit with hurricane victims.

Right, who does he think he is, being the PRESIDENT and carrying out the duties of a PRESIDENT when he had a media event that evening?

220 posted on 10/01/2004 9:42:30 AM PDT by RogueIsland
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