YET ANOTHER EXPERT, MORE ARGUMENTS AGAINST (CBS Documents)

National Review ^ | 9-9-04

[GraniteStateConservative]

Why not wait to put this out on Oct 31st?

[PAR35]

"The first IBM Composer was the IBM "Selectric" Composer announced in 1966. It was a hybrid "Selectric" typewriter that was modified to have proportional spaced fonts. It is 100% mechanical and has no digital electronics. Since it has no memory, the user was required to type everything twice. While typing the text the first time, the machine would measure the length of the line and count the number of spaces. When the user finished typing a line of text, they would record special measurements into the right margin of the paper. Once the entire column of text was typed and measured, it would then be retyped, however before typing each line, the operator would set the special justification dial (on the right side) to the proper settings, then type the line. The machine would automatically insert the appropriate amount of space between words so that all of the text would be justified.
http://ibmcomposer.org/

[WoofDog123]

"They went "whoops!" and scuttled along on their merry way. "

Though Whoops did include an undisclosed payment from GE to GM and an on-air live apology from the president of NBC news, IIRC.

[Barnstormer]

"My gut tells me Bagala and Carville are behind this."

My gut is telling me the same thing ----- what more perfect way to totally destroy Kerry's campaign credibility and turn the MSM viciously against the Dems, leaving Hillary to ride in and salvage the destitute party in 2008? I smell an internal hit job here ---- it HAD to be someone that CBS trusted so they'd go without vetting the documents thoroughly!

[Right Wing Professor]

So, you're gonna somehow pretend that a minor Lt Col fighter pilot in a minor Texas Air National Guard base, typing letters to himself on his own time (no C"clerk's initials nor author's initials, no "memorandum numbers, no file numbers, no code for subject matter and date stamp!) somehow got access to an expensive, single purpose proportional font typesetting machine in the early 1970's to write a "Cover Your Ass" memo TO HIMSELF that no body would EVER be interested in reading later about an obscure low-ranknig non-flying reserve junior officer who wanted to go to Alabama to serve EXTRA duty out of state?!?!?!?

LOL!

I think you covered most of the major issues. :-)

[TomGuy]

I wonder whether that squadran unit still exists.

Also, that POBox is: 3-4-5-6-7 (sequentially curious) Doing a google on that PO Box brought up this:

This is from a 1991 Harris County Health document.

===

Ashland Chemical Company, A Division of Ashland Oil, Incorporated

P. O. Box 34567

Houston

TACB Reg. VI - 31 TAC 116.5 - Varying from representations made in (Permit No. R-457)

11/20/91

9:20 AM

12/5/91

Air

8901 Old Galveston Road

[DaveMSmith]

Hannity just mentioned the forgeries... refered to Drudge then said he's been following it on freerepublic :) Hannity gave kudos to all freepers that are working this :)

[Mr Ramsbotham]

So, you're gonna somehow pretend that a minor Lt Col fighter pilot in a minor Texas Air National Guard base, typing letters to himself on his own time (no C"clerk's initials nor author's initials, no "memorandum numbers, no file numbers, no code for subject matter and date stamp!) somehow got access to an expensive, single purpose proportional font typesetting machine in the early 1970's to write a "Cover Your Ass" memo TO HIMSELF that no body would EVER be interested in reading later about an obscure low-ranknig non-flying reserve junior officer who wanted to go to Alabama to serve EXTRA duty out of state?!?!?!?!

Back in my typesetting days, before I opened my own small shop, I used my employer's expensive equipment to produce beautifully typeset letters for anyone I wanted to impress.

I'm not too sure what the price was for the Selectric Composer, but it wasn't a professional system. For someone doing a lot of writing, I can't imagine the cost would have been out of reach.

[muleskinner]

So, you're gonna somehow pretend that a minor Lt Col fighter pilot in a minor Texas Air National Guard base, typing letters to himself on his own time (no C"clerk's somehow got access to an expensive, single purpose proportional font typesetting machine in the early 1970's initials nor author's initials, no "memorandum numbers, no file numbers, no code for subject matter and date stamp!) to write a "Cover Your Ass" memo TO HIMSELF that no body would EVER be interested in reading later about an obscure low-ranknig non-flying reserve junior officer who wanted to go to Alabama to serve EXTRA duty out of state?!?!?!?!

Another excellent post and why Robert Cook, PE is an esteemed member of FR.

[RVN Airplane Driver]

Ellington has been closed for some time...taken over by private industry...hence your finding the chemical company.

[Boundless]

> "My gut tells me Bagala and Carville are behind this."

I would have guessed Hillary.

That forged documents favoring Kerry turn up is no
surprise.

That they are so clumsy, is.
If anyone in the chain of custody to CBS had a brain,
these were entirely too easy to spot.

[RVN Airplane Driver]

You obviously were never in the Military... Military guys before spending their own money would question giving a nickel to see the savior defacate a bale of hay on mainstreet before spending money on a fancy typewriter. Hell there was Martini's to be bought at the club....

[cyncooper]

I didn't believe this at first, but the evidence keeps piling up. If it really is a forgery I'm astounded, not that the left would stoop to this level, but that they'd be so incompetent.

I was extremely cautious about going down that road, besides not seeing how the content hurt Bush and it seems forgeries would attempt to do that. But more and more credible voices such as NRO and Michael Medved are pointing out there seem to be real questions here.

At a minimum CBS needs to answer to who gave them these records and how they had access to what they claimed was "Killian's personal file".

[EllaMinnow]

[Mr Ramsbotham]

You obviously were never in the Military... Military guys before spending their own money would question giving a nickel to see the savior defacate a bale of hay on mainstreet before spending money on a fancy typewriter. Hell there was Martini's to be bought at the club....

You're right about my never having been in the military. I was, however, drafted in 1971, and immediately went down to the Navy recruiter. Back in those days no one wanted to be in the infantry if he could possibly do anything else, and I don't think there was any disgrace in either Bush or Kerry joining some other branch of the service. In my case they found out that I was asthmatic, and reclassified me as 4-F. However, I've been around the military all my life, and your point is well taken.

I'm not too sure if I'm the one who opened up this can of worms with my post last night, playing the devil's advocate, but I really hate to see people go off the deep end without making a very good analysis of what they're looking at. We went through this with the Swift Boat photo that everyone swore had been Photoshopped, until conclusive evidence to the contrary came in.

[Dont Mention the War]

If this is true, Dan Rather's carrer is finished. What a dipsh*t.

Dan Rather will come out of this completely unfazed. CBS will stand by him for as long as he lives, no matter what. Mark my words.

[Trust but Verify]

Perhaps this has been covered but I haven't had time to read through all the threads on the topic. I found this paragraph in an AP story about the records revealed last night on 60 Minutes. Can someone explain to me if it is accurate? It's confusing. Where did the documents come from? CBS? the WH? If forged documents were released by the WH, then wouldn't someone there be a forger? I'm confused.

Yet, it was the White House — not Kerry's campaign — that distributed four memos from 1972 and 1973 from Lt. Col. Jerry Killian, now deceased, who was the commander of the 111th Fighter Interceptor Squadron in Houston where Bush served. The White House obtained the memos from CBS News, which said it was convinced of their authenticity, and the White House did not question their accuracy. There was no explanation why the Pentagon (news - web sites) was unable to find the documents on its own.

[js1138]

I'm SO glad we are getting beyond the "th" and the proportional font.

[cyncooper]

The documents were given to CBS by someone they refuse so far to identify. This person represented to them that the records came from "Killian's personal file". CBS says they had an expert then examine the records to authenticate.

CBS sent the WH copies for comment and that's how the WH got copies.

Of course a forger (I'm still on the doubtful side of that proposition) would not emanate from the WH!

[ambrose]

CBS faxed the docs to the White House before the story aired. The WH released those docs after the story aired. See the CBS fax header on the docs:

http://wid.ap.org/documents/bush/040908xfer.pdf