Request help from Military FReepers: Third Wound Policy

Kerry Edwards website ^ | self

[christie]

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I'm not military, so I have no knowledge of this. I've just never heard of this policy before.
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[christie]

ping

[boxerblues]

Curious myself, a google search mentions the rule but not the specific regulations

[Jammz]

To be honest, I'm USAF and I've been on 6 deployments and have never heard of this rule, but then again I've never gotten a purple heart and know very few people who have.

[christie]

. . . have never heard of this rule

Personally, I think they made this rule up for John Kerry just to get him the hell out of Dodge. Sounds like the guy was dangerous to have around.

[CWOJackson]

Third wound policy?

That would depend. Was it a scrape, a boo-boo or an owee?

[christie]

Or rice in the arse?

[Jammz]

I can neither confirm nor deny your statement no matter how absolutely right I think you are!

[calcowgirl]

Here's the best description I've seen of the Navy policy, followed by snips from the Kerry website re: his execution of the form:

www.campaigndesk.org/archives/000451.asp

The Campaign Desk
Critique and analysis of 2004 campaign coverage from Columbia Journalism Review

(snip)

The policy in question, the impenetrably-named BUPERS Instruction 1300.39, is no longer in place. During Vietnam, it mandated that any soldier "wounded three times, regardless of the nature of the wound or treatment required" should be "reassigned as having completed a full Vietnam tour with the hospital release date considered the tour completion date. They will not be ordered to Vietnam ..."

Furthermore, the official U.S. Navy document states that, "The commanding officer of an officer who is hospitalized and/or wounded under the above criteria will advise the Chief of Naval Personnel (Pers-B1) of the officer's location, duty status, and expected duration of hospitalization. Reassignment of the officer will be determined after consideration of his physical classification and on an individual basis."

An additional, virtually unreported section of the Navy code, notes that any soldier wishing to "waive reassignment under the purview of this Instruction must forward a written request to that effect to the Chief of Naval personnel (Pers-B) for final determination."

Kerry, of course, chose not to waive this order, and his commanding officers request for re-assignment can be viewed (PDF file) on the candidate's Web site.

www.johnkerry.com/pdf/jkmilservice/Thrice_Wounded_Reassignment.pdf

R 170730Z Mar 69
FM COMCOSRON ONE

A. BUPERSINST 1300.39

1. LTJG John Forbes Kerry USNR has been thrice wounded in action while on duty incountry Vietnam. Reassignment is requested IAW Ref A.

2. LTJG Kerry req duty as personal aide in Boston, New Yor or Wash, D.C. area. If aide, assignment not avail then any assignment considered qualified for.

3. LTJG Kerry presently on full duty status and available for reassignment.

[Captain Rhino]

During my tour in Vietnam with a Marine infantry battalion (68-69), the only "rule" that I encountered was the third wound (which had to be a real wound requiring evacuation out of the field and some period of recovery at a medical facility in the rear) normally got you out of the bush for the remainder of your tour. I think the logic behind it was that if you were still alive after being wounded three times, you had pretty well used up your quotient of good luck and something had to be done to keep you out of harm's way so you could live to complete your tour.

Actually had a friend from high school whose life was probably saved by this rule. Ran into him in the 7th Marines Regimental Mess Hall at Hill 55 (I Corps). He was a month away from completing his tour and permanently with his infantry company's rear element after his third wound.

Had another friend who benefited from the one wound rule. Met him coming out of the enlisted club at MCRD San Diego. Tried to shake hands but he couldn't. He was a radio operator and had been machine gunned. Had holes in his right hand, right arm and across his belly. He was over at the Balboa Naval Hospital recovering and undergoing reconstructive surgery. His ONE wound had been severe enough to take him completely out of the war zone.

The evacuation policy was designed to keep you in theater. We had Marines treated at the Battalion Aid Station, 121st(?) Evac Hospital in Da Nang, at the naval hospitals at Cam Rahn Bay and at Subic in the P.I. If you could recover, return to duty status, and complete your tour, it was your duty to do so. You had to be pretty screwed up to get evacuated all the way back to the States.

Any Marine in my battalion that showed up at sickbay claiming to need treatment for the wounds that "cut 'n run" Kerry claims rated Purple Hearts, would have been wounded alright. Wounded by his platoon sergeant taking his number 10 boot to his malingering as*. All that was needed to treat injuries like that was your first aid kit. Cut, bruised and bandaged was SOP for field operations.

You simply didn't leave your fellow Marines shorthanded in the bush by pulling some sleazy stunt like Kerry did. My personal opinion is that he got scared the VC might close out John F'n Kerry's personnel record before he could be like that other JFK (who, despite his flaws and tragic death as president, was a grade A genuine war hero). Kerry, on the other hand, probably has a big streak of ... no, I don't want to go there. But it would go a long way to explain his flip flopping.

[boxerblues]

snippets on BUPERS Instruction 1300.39

BUPERS Instruction 1300.39, no longer exists,

Never used before Navel Regulation,


was this a regulation designed just for kerry and then discountinued?

[christie]

"wounded three times, regardless of the nature of the wound or treatment required"

wounded three times, or wounded in action three times.

This is important, because if the wound needed to be while under enemy fire, and Kerry invented the enemy fire . . . fraud?

[USMCVet]

Want to second Capt. Rhino's comments about infantry Marines in Vietnam; I saw a lot of unreported minor wounds - particularly the omnipresent grenade frag wounds. Throwing an M-26 frag grenade virtually guaranteed that you'd be hit by your own steel - and the Marine 'grunts' that were hit that way would have the corpsman pick the pieces out, smear in some Johnson & Johnson First Aid Cream, bandage and keep going.

We were good at what we did and stuck together and nobody wanted to leave your friends behind.

It's very hard to understand how John Kerry could leave the crew that depended on him after only 1/3rd of tour.

[Warrior Nurse]

It's very hard to understand how John Kerry could leave the crew that depended on him after only 1/3rd of tour

You are right but judging from what Steve Gardner said I don't think Kerry's crew depended on him at all. He was a piss poor leader in the field. If he was with a line company he would have gotten men killed. He is not an example of the warrior ethos.

Semper Fi

USMC 1982-1990

[oldngray]

Sounds as though you and I were in about the same place at about the same time... remembering exactly the same circumstances.

Semper Fi (7thMar)

[A.A. Cunningham]

JFK (who, despite his flaws and tragic death as president, was a grade A genuine war hero).

That is debatable.

You'll have to register with the Naval Institute to read the following:

Did JFK's Order Sink PT-109?

[Blood of Tyrants]

As far as I know, this was a Defense Dept policy. The more cowardly draftees would go to the doctor for every scratch in hopes of getting their three PH's and an out. Some doctors would willingly sign them and others would send them out the door with a swift kick in the ass.

The regulations state that for a PH to be awarded, (1) it must have been received as a result of direct enemy action. If your helo crashes due to mechanical failure, even in combat, you don't get a PH, nor do you get one for stupidly getting rice in your butt from being too close to an explosion you caused; (2) it must REQUIRE treatment by a doctor. If a doctor did, but a corpsman or medic could have handled it (as all three of Kerry's PH's were superficial wounds and were treatable by a corpsman), it doesn't qualify.

[GivemeaBREAK!]

Everyone is wrong that Kerry was sent home because of 3 PHs.

Kerry was sent home as a reward for a new operational method for rendering captured supplies useless. He perfected the

"I poison FOODSTOCKS by shooting them into my BUTTOCKS"

A well earned reward and he's been sitting on this laurel for over 30 years.

[calcowgirl]

wounded three times, or wounded in action three times.

This is important, because if the wound needed to be while under enemy fire, and Kerry invented the enemy fire . . . fraud?

Good question. I have no way of knowing and haven't found anything conclusive.

[USMCVet]

If he was with a line company he would have gotten men killed. He is not an example of the warrior ethos.

Couldn't agree with you more. Everything I hear about his performance suggests that he was more than willing to risk everyone around him to build up his bio.

By the way, has anybody besides me wondered how a place can be in 'hot and heavy combat' one day, yet safe enough to run around freely to stage movies the next day?

Semper Fi,

11th Marines and 1st Marines, '66-'67