Well, thanks, it isn't every day that I'm called a liar. I didn't see the bird myself but absolutely believe the Swift Boat Vet that he received it. His elation at the gift from Kerry was unabashed and spontaneous. But doubt us if you wish. There were plenty of others at the event with cameras but then again, would you consider a photograph credible? I would be interested to hear what your definition of a credible witness might be. Is it that if a priest doesn't witness a tree fall in the forest that it didn't?
Well, thanks, it isn't every day that I'm called a liar.
___________
So who called you a liar? I sure didn't (by any reasonable person's standards). I don't doubt that you believe what you heard, but since you did not see it, you're not an eyewitness (kind of by definition). You're not a witness in any way shape or form.
Certainly by highlighting the fact that we have no one here who actually saw the act, not once but twice, isn't is OK to at least question whether or not it happened (given that he is currently one of the most constantly photographed person on the planet)?
I am totally open to the truth of this, as I made quite clear in my initial post, why else would I make an offer to retract my statement?
Judging by the freepmail I've received on this topic, I am not the only freeper puzzled by the lack of video.
I don't think "dmz" called you a liar - you DIDN'T actually see it, did you?
This is what's called "hearsay."
No doubt true, but hearsay nonetheless.
No picture here either, but here's a report on the first instance from http://www.newsmax.com/archives/ic/2004/5/31/225546.shtml
Monday, May 31, 2004 10:53 p.m. EDT
Kerry 'Flips Off' Vietnam Vet
Former Congressman John Leboutillier reports on a
Memorial Day confrontation between Sen. John Kerry
and a fellow Vietnam veteran:
Democratic senator - and certain presidential nominee
- John F. Kerry gave the middle finger to a Vietnam
veteran at the Vietnam Memorial Wall on Memorial Day
morning, NewsMax.com has learned.
Ted Sampley, a former Green Beret who served two full
tours in Vietnam, spotted Kerry and his Secret
Service detail at about 9:00 a.m. Monday morning at
the Wall. Sampley walked up to Kerry, extended his
hand and said, "Senator, I am Ted Sampley, the head
of Vietnam Veterans Against John Kerry, and I am here
to escort you away from the Wall because you do not
belong here."
At that point a Secret Service officer told Sampley
to back away from Kerry. Sampley moved about 6 feet
away and opened his jacket to reveal a HANOI JOHN
T-shirt.
Kerry then began talking to a group of
schoolchildren. Sampley then showed the T-shirt to
the children and said, "Kerry does not belong at the
Wall because he betrayed the brave soldiers who
fought in Vietnam."
Just then Kerry - in front of the school children,
other visitors and Secret Service agents - brazenly
'flashed the bird' at Sampley and then yelled out to
everyone, "Sampley is a felon!"
Kerry was referring to an incident 12 years ago when
Sampley confronted Sen. John McCain's chief aide,
Mark Salter, in a Senate stairwell after McCain
repeatedly offended POW families at a Senate POW
hearing. Sampley, whose father-in-law at that time
was MIA in Laos, followed Salter into the stairwell
and, when they emerged, Salter had a bloody lip and a
broken nose.
Sampley's group, Vietnam Veterans Against John Kerry,
has garnered huge national attention and has been
featured in the New York Times, the Washington Post
and on MSNBC's "Scarborough Country." Tens of
thousands of Vietnam vets have registered their
opposition to Kerry through Sampley's group.
Clearly Sampley has gotten under Kerry's skin once
again.
Stand down. No one has called you a liar in this thread.
I didn't see the bird myself but absolutely believe the Swift Boat Vet that he received it. His elation at the gift from Kerry was unabashed and spontaneous. But doubt us if you wish.
Its not a question of doubt, its a question of proof. Photographs are fine but can be and are faked every day, providing instant plausible deniability to the Rats.
You know the saying that "A picture is worth a thousand words?" In this particular case, all we are saying is that something as simple as a $100 video camera in the right hands could have cost Kerry thousands of votes and possibly even the election.