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Moon Viewed as Policy Battleground
space.com ^ | 17 Jul 04 | Leonard David

Posted on 07/17/2004 4:15:05 PM PDT by RightWhale

Moon Viewed as Policy Battleground

By Leonard David, Senior Space Writer

posted: 05:30 am ET, 17 July 2004

LAS VEGAS, NEVADA -- Left solely in NASA’s hands the forecast is cloudy for realizing a 21st century where the Earth's moon is a bastion of creativity, economic growth, as well as a foothold for humanity’s greater leaps into deep space.

For attendees of the 5th annual Return to the Moon conference being held here from July 16-18, it is up to the private sector to help realize President Bush's new vision for space exploration and to revitalize humanity's forays to the Moon and beyond.

It’s not about just astronauts strutting across the lunar surface, said Manny Pimenta, Return to the Moon Project Director of the Space Frontier Foundation, the group that organized the conference. "We need to create in people’s minds that the possibility of space settlement is actually possible with the technology that exists today," Pimenta said. "It is inevitable that we will be living, working and playing on the Moon someday.,"

Alternative space movement

Rick Tumlinson, founder of the Space Frontier Foundation believes we are at the dawning of a "new American space age," calling attention to the recent flight of SpaceShipOne, the privately backed effort that lobbed a pilot to the edge of space last month. SpaceShipOne -- and other entrepreneurial efforts now ongoing -- signal the emergence and fast-paced nature of a "new alternative space movement," Tumlinson argued. Another positive step is a major revamp of NASA, Tumlinson suggested. That overhaul, he said, is due in part to the Columbia tragedy in February 2003, as well as U.S. President George W. Bush’s call last January for a return to the Moon, then onward to Mars and beyond.

Tumlinson said that work is underway to "de-Bushify" NASA’s visionary call to arms, in order for it to be shared by both political parties. "From the President’s mouth to NASA’s ears is one hell of a journey," Tumlinson said, one that demands a private sector-government partnership or it will fail.

Business as unusual

"Hopefully, we are transitioning from old NASA to a new NASA," said James Benson, head of SpaceDev, a private space firm near San Diego, California. "We can still keep bashing NASA, but now we have to bash the old NASA and hope the new one emerges," he said. That coming out party for a new NASA is tied to contracts the agency is soon awarding -- contracts intended to jell the President’s space initiative into a true action plan. Benson said in the next six months, "either history will be written…or we’ll be back to business as usual." Business as unusual would have NASA go beyond the traditional aerospace prime contractor community, Benson said. Doing so would assure more innovation, fast turnaround of products at lower-cost, he said.

One early endeavor, Benson said, is ringing the Moon with microsats. These would serve as a lunar Global Positioning System (GPS). For one, this lunar GPS would guide spacecraft loaded with equipment and science packages to safe, pinpoint landings at prime real estate on the Moon. "We need to start building the infrastructure around the Moon now, as technology enablers," Benson explained.

Clear direction

"I sense a change in the wind…a disturbance in the force," joked Paul Spudis, a planetary scientist at The Johns Hopkins University Applied Physics Laboratory in Laurel, Maryland. Spudis was also a member of the President's Commission on Implementation of United States Space Exploration Policy that recently reported on how best to put polemics into practice. Spudis saluted the space vision statement by U.S. President Bush of January 14th of this year, but the question remains: What NASA is supposed to become? "This was a different kind of vision," Spudis said. "For once we actually have a clear direction for our space program." To eliminate human spaceflight and do academic robotic space science forever has been rejected by the White House, Spudis observed. What is now on the table is to actually use space resources to leverage things "to actually give you more than you have now."

Hidden agenda

Spudis said that there are people within NASA who are failing to see what the President has asked to be put in motion. "This is as clear a policy direction as we’ve ever had. And yet people at NASA persist in misunderstanding it." There are those at NASA with an agenda "to kill this or morph it into something that it was never intended to be," Spudis warned. The idea of a quick "touch and go" at the Moon, then get to Mars "because that’s where the real science is," is dead wrong, Spudis observed, based on the President’s directive. "The point is to use the Moon to enable voyages elsewhere. Plus I dare say we actually have a few things we might be able to do on the Moon as well. It is an interesting place in its own right," Spudis said.

Tyranny of the rocket equation

There’s a lot of spade work to on the Moon first to enable a humans to Mars mission that is safe and easily done, Spudis told conference attendees. "The vision is about creating new capability," Spudis added. "Right now humans are stuck in low Earth orbit. Robots are mass, power, and bandwidth limited. We want to break that. We want to be able to break the tyranny of the rocket equation."

That would be accomplished by using the resources that are available in space. And the Moon is the closest place to put that into practice, Spudis said. "So, fundamentally, we need to play the hand that nature’s dealt us, Spudis concluded. "Since we’re here in Las Vegas…think of it in gambling terms. This is the hand we’ve got…can you play it or not?"


TOPICS: Business/Economy; Culture/Society; Extended News; Government
KEYWORDS: nasa; private; property; rights; space
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To: GeronL

The powers that be could safely ignore that entrepreneur since he would eventually go away on his own. The lunar deeds and Mars deeds that you can buy now are only quitclaim deeds and so are being rightly ignored by the sovereign states. By the same logic I own the Asteroid Belt by prior claim.


21 posted on 07/17/2004 7:41:01 PM PDT by RightWhale (Withdraw from the 1967 UN Outer Space Treaty and establish property rights)
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To: dr_who_2
It comes with the job. You or I would have to do the same.

His campaign 4 years ago--not him personally but a representative he sent to Houston--said that the Bush admin would investigate the issue of private property rights in outer space.

This is taking forever, but his President's Commission report said that lack of private property rights in outer space would strangle nascent businesses in the cradle. Oh, yeah, strangle in the cradle. One of them is a poet.

22 posted on 07/17/2004 7:46:36 PM PDT by RightWhale (Withdraw from the 1967 UN Outer Space Treaty and establish property rights)
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To: RightWhale
Hey, there's a chocolate cake in the asteroid belt.. and you can't prove there isn't..

And I own the rights to it.. ;o)

23 posted on 07/17/2004 7:47:52 PM PDT by Drammach (Freedom; not just a job, it's an adventure..)
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To: RightWhale
Of course I also had a dream that I launched a company and created the Magnetic Pulse Injection Reaction Engine. Using this proprietary technology I not only built cities on the moon but on Mars and large space stations to boot.

I just have to figure out how the MPIRE worked in the dream and I shall be rich rich rich =o)

24 posted on 07/17/2004 7:49:51 PM PDT by GeronL (wketchup.com........................www.bushcountryketchup.com)
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To: Drammach

You could sell quitclaim deeds to interest in the cake. It could catch on. Mood rings, pet rocks, hula hoops, Cabbage Patch Kids, Asteroid Cake. You could make $8 and spend only $800 advertising and burn only 1000 hours of your time. Or you might make $8 million. Don't know until you try.


25 posted on 07/17/2004 7:56:08 PM PDT by RightWhale (Withdraw from the 1967 UN Outer Space Treaty and establish property rights)
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To: GeronL

You need investment money for research. Property rights would attract investment. Get some property rights.


26 posted on 07/17/2004 7:58:08 PM PDT by RightWhale (Withdraw from the 1967 UN Outer Space Treaty and establish property rights)
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To: RightWhale

we should use the moon as a military base, to aid in the expansion of our empire. either that or just plant some flowers on it.


27 posted on 07/17/2004 8:00:01 PM PDT by isom35
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To: GeronL
MIRE....

Another Million Dollar Idea..
Just waiting to happen.. ;oP

28 posted on 07/17/2004 8:02:49 PM PDT by Drammach (Freedom; not just a job, it's an adventure..)
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To: All
The space policy promulgated by GWB is a return to common sense in space exploration. Von Braun devised the various steps needed to go to the Moon, and saw lunar exploration as the necessary step to going to Mars. The so-called ISS is behind schedule, probably will never be finished, but by the time it is (or isn't), will be dumped into the Pacific. The US needs a new way to put humans into space, and a heavy lift capability to do that, and anything else.

Kerry is stuck with saying (as he has) that GWB's plan is a step backward, which means he's in favor of, hmm, what exactly? Spending $400 billion to try to reach Mars, then never go back? Spending $500 million per STS flight in order to complete the ISS (with one less orbiter than was available before the Columbia disaster). Kerry is a loser. Edwards may wind up the 2008 candidate, but if he manages to win the nomination, he won't be able to shake the loser stench, or the perception that he's a lightweight and petty thief, er, lawyer.

Hey, John-John, how about you cut the NASA budget? Good timing -- cutting gov't programs of that kind should really help you in California, Texas, Florida, Washington... Cassini reached Saturn this month and has been knocking everyone for a loop. How about the Mars probes? Gonna discontinue those? How about cutting spending on development of the needed heavy lift capability and crew vehicles? Maybe Burt Rutan can be brought in to build a badminton shuttlecock version of a space vehicle for NASA?
Everyday Astronaut
by Scott Gourley
June 21 2004
Popular Mechanics
Publicly thanking Paul G. Allen, who admitted to investing more than $20 million in the project, Rutan appeared to physically choke up when he said, "We were able to develop a complete space program from scratch for the price of one of those government paper studies." ...Mojave Airport Manager Stu Witt... said. "Nobody's ever done anything like this before," Pearson said. "That's part of what's unique about America--nowhere else in the world. It's a great day for the country." Non-military government involvement was limited. In fact, according to Rutan, the first contact between NASA and the program participants came in a phone call to Rutan the day before the launch to notify him that NASA would like to send an observer.

29 posted on 07/17/2004 8:56:23 PM PDT by SunkenCiv (Unlike some people, I have a profile. Okay, maybe it's a little large...)
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To: Drammach; RightWhale; GeronL; LibWhacker; SunkenCiv
Article I

The exploration and use of outer space, including the moon and other celestial bodies, shall be carried out for the benefit and in the interests of all countries, irrespective of their degree of economic or scientific development, and shall be the province of all mankind.

Outer space, including the moon and other celestial bodies, shall be free for exploration and use by all States without discrimination of any kind, on a basis of equality and in accordance with international law, and there shall be free access to all areas of celestial bodies.

There shall be freedom of scientific investigation in outer space, including the moon and other celestial bodies, and States shall facilitate and encourage international co-operation in such investigation.

Article II

Outer space, including the moon and other celestial bodies, is not subject to national appropriation by claim of sovereignty, by means of use or occupation, or by any other means. .

* * *

Article XI

In order to promote international co-operation in the peaceful exploration and use of outer space, States Parties to the Treaty conducting activities in outer space, including the Moon and other celestial bodies, agree to inform the Secretary-General of the United Nations as well as the public and the international scientific community, to the greatest extent feasible and practicable, of the nature, conduct, locations and results of such activities. On receiving the said information, the Secretary-General of the United Nations should be prepared to disseminate it immediately and effectively.

Article XII

All stations, installations, equipment and space vehicles on the Moon and other celestial bodies shall be open to representatives of other States Parties to the Treaty on a basis of reciprocity. Such representatives shall give reasonable advance notice of a projected visit, in order that appropriate consultations may be held and that maximum precautions may be taken to assure safety and to avoid interference with normal operations in the facility to be visited.

Article XVI

Any State Party to the Treaty may give notice of its withdrawal from the Treaty one year after its entry into force by written notification to the Depositary Governments. Such withdrawal shall take effect one year from the date of receipt of this notification.

http://www.state.gov/t/ac/trt/5181.htm#treaty

Still see no problem Drammach?

P.S. Any ongoing commercial activity in Antartica?

30 posted on 07/18/2004 3:18:29 PM PDT by frithguild ("W" is the Black Ice President - underestimated until the left completely loses traction.)
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To: frithguild
Still see no problem Drammach?

No problem..
Sounds very much like what I described..

Please note the last entry to the treaty..
Any participant can withdraw at any time..

I would suggest if matters take a different turn, ( I leave that open to interpretation.. ) then the U.S. can withdraw from the treaty, and make claims of Sovereignty one year later...

I would suggest that, after a matter of years, (or decades) if no other nations have managed to develop sites on the moon, the U.S. would have the right to withdraw from the treaty, and claim property rights..

Antarctic sites have generally been for scientific research, not commercial venture..
Can't think of one single reason to go to the trouble of trying to even start a commercial venture there..
Makes no sense..

31 posted on 07/18/2004 3:37:19 PM PDT by Drammach (Freedom; not just a job, it's an adventure..)
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To: Drammach
the U.S. would have the right to withdraw from the treaty, and claim property rights..

The private sector has had the capability to go into space for 40+ years. So far it is just commsats and a few camsats. What is the holdup?

The holdup is lack of investment money due to lack of property rights. Should have been there 40 years ago. Could have been mining asteroids for 25 years by now.

There is no need to wait for the right or to demonstrate something. The US has had the right since it signed the 1967 Treaty, and has asserted its sovereignty over all outer space by signing the Treaty.

32 posted on 07/18/2004 4:35:23 PM PDT by RightWhale (Withdraw from the 1967 UN Outer Space Treaty and establish property rights)
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To: RightWhale
Article II only prohibits "national" appropriation.. not private..

A private person or corporation should have no problem claiming property rights to the land and facilities which are built on them..

33 posted on 07/18/2004 5:26:35 PM PDT by Drammach (Freedom; not just a job, it's an adventure..)
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To: Drammach
"Any participant can withdraw at any time." What a huge relief. :') Yeah, Antarctica is claimed by a few countries still, I think, but the only attempt at colonization was on Deception cove (or bay, or whatever), by the Chileans. Somethin' to do with the climate? ;')
34 posted on 07/18/2004 5:33:17 PM PDT by SunkenCiv (Unlike some people, I have a profile. Okay, maybe it's a little large...)
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To: RightWhale
Withdraw from the 1967 UN Outer Space Treaty and establish property rights

We'll never have property rights on the Moon or on any other real estate in space until some granting authority that actually respects private property rights, claims the Moon as its own and begins handing out/selling land grants to individuals and businesses. At least that's how I see it. If we wait for China or the UN to agree to the establishment of private property rights in space, it'll never happen! We have to claim the Moon as American territory.

Also possible, but much less desirable imo, is to claim a large chunk of it and let other nations that actually get there, also claim their chunk. I'm not a lawyer, of course, as you can tell, lol!

35 posted on 07/18/2004 5:49:35 PM PDT by LibWhacker
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To: SunkenCiv
Something to do with the climate.. Yeah... LOL!

Same thing with Moon, space in general.. No Atmosphere, extreme temperatures, specialized structures/clothing (pressurized atmosphere) etc..
Survival becomes pre-eminent concern..

As was said by a great writer,
"The Moon Is A Harsh Mistress"..

36 posted on 07/18/2004 7:00:27 PM PDT by Drammach (Freedom; not just a job, it's an adventure..)
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To: Drammach

Article I, which states "The ... use of ... the moon ... shall be the province of all mankind." makes it the right and obligation of signatories to nullify any claim of the right to posses any portion of it. Lets say Mr. Rutan makes it to the moon and he claims to own the area where he lands. Do you think the French would put up with that or would they prosecute a claim in the World Court and cite Article I??

Sheesh.


37 posted on 07/18/2004 7:02:46 PM PDT by frithguild ("W" is the Black Ice President - underestimated until the left completely loses traction.)
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To: LibWhacker
We'll never have property rights on the Moon or on any other real estate in space until some granting authority that actually respects private property rights, claims the Moon as its own and begins handing out/selling land grants to individuals and businesses. At least that's how I see it.

Actually, we'll never have property rights on the Moon till
someone gets up there and stakes a claim and is able to live
on the surface, and presumably is able to defend that claim
against any one trying to take it.

Then we'll have property rights.
38 posted on 07/18/2004 7:05:58 PM PDT by tet68 ( " We would not die in that man's company, that fears his fellowship to die with us...." Henry V.)
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To: Drammach

Impossible. It doesn't work that way.


39 posted on 07/18/2004 7:14:50 PM PDT by RightWhale (Withdraw from the 1967 UN Outer Space Treaty and establish property rights)
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To: LibWhacker

Yep. That's the general idea. China has property rights now, you know.


40 posted on 07/18/2004 7:18:54 PM PDT by RightWhale (Withdraw from the 1967 UN Outer Space Treaty and establish property rights)
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