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To: the OlLine Rebel
And I think you'll find there was nothing beyond local "control" of minutemen - like the militia of which they were part. It's not as if we had military experts roaming the entire countryside who knew just how to train and maneuvers, etc.

They elected their own officers & non-coms . . . not that it mattered much, for they didn't even follow their officers' orders if they didn't want to. At Lexington and Concord, most engagements didn't even take place in company strength---they were "run and gun" battles along the road from Concord to Boston.

About the only good thing you could say for the militia as a fighting force is that a large number of them were veterans of the French and Indian War.

155 posted on 07/16/2004 1:05:36 PM PDT by Hemingway's Ghost (Spirit of '75)
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To: Hemingway's Ghost

I know what I am talking about.
I have oral history handed down to me from my forefathers generations ago.
I present my case by family history and historical precedent for the RIGHT TO BEAR ARMS.

(7 of my family fought on Breed's Hill (Bunker Hill)
My family has had weapons and firearms since 1620, including muskets, blunderbusses, rifled muskets, rifles, civil war rifles, rifles brought home from WWI, WWII, KOREA and Vietnam, including Enfields, British sniper rifles, M-1 carbines, German lugers, and AK47's right off the plane from San Francisco from Saigon in 1975. My family has fought in the New England Indian Wars, Queen Ann's War, Fort St. Frederic (Fort Crown Point), Fort Ticonderoga, French and Indian War, Battle of Bloody Pond, Stark’s Rangers, Whitcomb’s Rangers, Green Mountain Boys, Bunker Hill, Battle of Bennington, Saratoga II, Connecticut British raid, War of 1812 Battle of Plattsburg, Civil War at Gettysburg- New York 5th Cavalry (Hammond's 5th New York Troopers charging Jeb Stuart's Confederate Cavalry) (using our own Morgan chargers -we still breed them), including:

* 2nd NY Cavalry
* 5th NY Cavalry
* 2nd NY Infantry
* 9th NY Infantry
* 13th NY Infantry
* 34th NY Infantry
* 65th NY Infantry
* 76th NY Infantry
* 83rd NY Infantry
* 96th NY Infantry
* 118th NY Infantry
* 13th NY Artillery
* 16th NY Artillery
* 23rd NY Artillery
* 62nd NY Zouaves
* 1st VT Cavalry
* 11th VT Infantry
* 14th VT Infantry
* 50th OH Infantry
* 20th WI Infantry\
then
* 12th US Infantry, WW1, WWII North Africa Tunisia Theatre, and Germany, Korea MIA's, Grenada, Vietnam Afghanistan and Iraq.

Since 1620, my family knows possession of arms was antecedent to the U.S. constitution; everyone of my family had arms under Dutch, British and French rule;

Even my maternal relatives, Mohawks, have borne arms on and off the reservation guaranteed by British treaty of 1763 and numerous U.S, Govt treaties unbroken to this very day.

If U.S. govt guarantees my cousins on the reservation to bear arms FOREVER, so much the more are we all Americans from our foundation exercising that right from 1620 in New England and New York and even earlier (1607, and even earlier in the Northern French colonies in New England and New York) in the other colonies before the Articles of Confederation and the U.S. Constitution.

The U.S. Constitution is a CONFIRMATION and AFFIRMATION of pre-existing conditions, practices and rights of the people dating back to 1066 Magna Carta and brought to our shores by my ancestors from England. (In 1051, in England, Edward the Confessor, raised an army of his own and, since he was king and had the power of mobilizing the fyrd, or NATIONAL MILITIA; most of the other English nobles, who were jealous of Godwin's power, sided with Edward.)

The U.S. Constitution is not a proposal, but an affirmation, a WITNESS to practices back to our ancestors landing here.


The 13 Colonies' Charters and Constitutions mostly pre-dated the U.S. Constitution and the U.S. Constitution drew upon them for the Bill of Rights.

The rights against the English King obtained in 1066 were re-affirmed by rightful LEGAL force of arms by the PEOPLE in 1775 at Concord on the Green and postulated as fact and rights affirmed by our founding Fathers in tHe U.S. Constitution.
(http://www.archives.gov/exhibit_hall/featured_documents/magna_carta/)


COMMON LAW DERIVED FROM MAGNA CARTA:

New Jersey Constitution, 1776

And whereas, in the present deplorable situation of these
COLONIES, exposed to the fury of a cruel and relentless enemy,
some form of government is absolutely necessary, not only for the
preservation of good order, but also the more effectually TO UNITE THE PEOPLE,
and enable them to exert THEIR WHOLE FORCE in their
own necessary defence

XXII. That the common law of England, as well as so much of
the statute law, as have been heretofore practised in this Colony,
shall still remain in force…
In PROVINCIAL CONGRESS, New Jersey,
Burlington, July 2, 1776.

By order of Congress.
SAMUEL TUCKER, Pres.
William Paterson, Secretary.



http://www.state.nj.us/njfacts/njdoc10a.htm





Massachusetts Charter of 1629:
And, further our Will and Pleasure is, and Wee doe hereby for Us, our Heires and Successors, ordeyne and declare, and graunte to the saide Governor and Company and their Successors, That all and every the Subjects of Us, our Heires or Successors, which shall goe to and inhabite within the saide Landes and Premisses hereby mentioned to be graunted, and every of their Children which shall happen to be borne there, or on the Seas in goeing thither, or retorning from thence, shall have and enjoy ALL LIBERTIES and Immunities of free and naturall Subjects within any of the Domynions of Us, our Heires or Successors, to all Intents, Constructions, and Purposes whatsoever, as if they and everie of them were borne within the Realme of England.
(http://www.law.ou.edu/hist/massbay.html)



Mass constitution 1780

Article XVII. The people have a RIGHT TO KEEP AND TO BEAR ARMS for the common defence.
http://www.mass.gov/legis/const.htm


Rhode Island Charter

And THAT THEY MAY BEE IN THE BETTER CAPACITY TO DEFEND THEMSELVES, IN THEIRE JUST RIGHTS AND LIBERTYES against all the enemies of the Christian ffaith, and others, in all respects, wee have further thought fit, and at the humble petition of the persons aforesayd are gratiously pleased to declare, That they shall have and enjoye the benefist of our late act of indempnity and ffree pardon, as the rest of our subjects in other our dominions and territoryes have; and to create and make them a bodye politique or corporate, with the powers and priviledges hereinafter mentioned.

http://www.yale.edu/lawweb/avalon/states/ri04.htm


Rhode Island Constitution 1986

Sec. 22. The RIGHT OF THE PEOPLE TO KEEP AND BEAR ARMS shall not be infringed.
http://www.harbornet.com/rights/r-island.txt


Connecticut Constitution

Sec. 15. Every citizen has a RIGHT TO BEAR ARMS in defense of himself and the state.

http://www.harbornet.com/rights/connecti.txt



Maine Constitution 1993

Article 1
Section 16. To keep and bear arms. Every citizen has a RIGHT TO KEEP AND BEAR ARMS and this right shall never be questioned.
http://janus.state.me.us/legis/const/


New Hampshire Constitution

ESTABLISHED OCTOBER 31, 1783 TO TAKE EFFECT JUNE 2, 1784 AS SUBSEQUENTLY AMENDED AND IN FORCE DECEMBER 1990

[Art.] 2-a. [The Bearing of Arms.]. All persons have the RIGHT TO KEEP AND BEAR ARMS in defense of themselves, their families, their property and the state.
December l, 1982

http://www.state.nh.us/constitution/billofrights.html


Vermont Constitution 1777

Article 16th. Right to bear arms; standing armies; military power subordinate to civil

That the people have a RIGHT TO BEAR ARMS for the defence
of themselves and the State - and as standing armies in time
of peace are dangerous to liberty, they ought not to be kept up;
and that the military should be kept under strict subordination to and governed by the civil power.
www.usconstitution.net/vtconst.html


"A well regulated militia being necessary to the security of a free state, the RIGHT OF THE PEOPLE TO KEEP AND BEAR ARMS cannot be infringed."

New York State Civil Rights Law Article 2, Section 4


Pennsylvania Constitution

Right to Bear Arms
Section 21.
The RIGHT OF THE CITIZENS TO BEAR ARMS in defense of themselves and
the State shall not be questioned.
http://sites.state.pa.us/PA_Constitution.html


Virginia Constitution 1776

SEC. 13. That a well-regulated MILITIA, composed of THE BODY OF THE PEOPLE,
trained to arms, is the proper, natural, and safe defence of a
free State; that standing armies, in time of peace, should be avoided,
as dangerous to liberty; and that in all cases the military should be
under strict subordination to, and governed by, the civil power.

http://www.nhinet.org/ccs/docs/va-1776.htm



North Carolina Constitution 1776

XVII. That the people have a RIGHT TO BEAR ARMS, for the defence of the State; and, as standing armies, in time of peace, are dangerous to liberty, they ought not to be kept up; and that the military should be kept under strict subordination to, and governed by, the civil power.
http://www.yale.edu/lawweb/avalon/states/nc07.htm




North Carolina Constitution amended to 1975

Sec. 30. A well regulated militia being necessary to the security of a free state, the RIGHT OF THE PEOPLE TO KEEP AND BEAR ARMS shall not be infringed; and, as standing armies in time of peace are dangerous to liberty, they shall not be maintained, and the military shall be kept under strict subordination to, and governed by, the civil power. Nothing herein shall justify the practice of carrying concealed weapons, or prevent the General Assembly from enacting statues against that practice.

http://www.harbornet.com/rights/no-carol.txt


South Carolina Constitution (as revised to 1981)

Sec. 20. A well regulated militia being necessary to the security of a free state, the RIGHT OF THE PEOPLE TO BEAR ARMS shall not be infringed. As, in times of peace, armies are dangerous to liberty, they shall not be maintained without the consent of the General Assembly. The military power of the State shall always be held in subordination to the civil authority and be governed by it. No soldier shall in time of peace be quartered in any house without the consent of the owner nor in time of war but in a manner prescribed by law.
http://www.harbornet.com/rights/s-carol.txt


Georgia Constitution Feb. 5, 1777

ART. XXXV. Every county in this State that has, or hereafter may have, two hundred and fifty men, and upwards, LIABLE TO BEAR ARMS, shall be formed into a battalion; and when they become too numerous for one battalion, they shall be formed into more, by bill of the legislature;
and those counties that have a less number than two hundred and fifty shall be formed into independent companies.

http://www.yale.edu/lawweb/avalon/states/ga02.htm


Florida Constitution of 1838:
Section 21. That the free white men of this State shall have the RIGHT TO KEEP AND BEAR ARMS, for their common defense.

http://www.law.fsu.edu/crc/conhist/1838con.html



==CONSTITUTION OF THE STATE OF TENNESSEE

ADOPTED IN CONVENTION AT NASHVILLE,

FEBRUARY 23, 1870


Sec. 26. Right to bear arms--Regulations.--
That the citizens of this State have a RIGHT TO KEEP AND BEAR ARMS for their common defense; but the Legislature
shall have power, by law, to regulate the wearing of arms
with a view to prevent crime.

http://www.divorcetn.com/d18.htm


Kentucky Constitution (as amended to 1980)

Seventh: The RIGHT TO BEAR ARMS in defense of themselves and of the State, subject to the power of the General Assembly to enact laws to prevent persons from carrying concealed weapons.
http://www.harbornet.com/rights/kentucky.txt



Louisiana Constitution

Sec. 11. The RIGHT OF EACH CITIZEN TO KEEP AND BEAR ARMS shall not be abridged, but this provision shall not prevent the passage of laws to prohibit the carrying of weapons concealed on the person.

...
www.harbornet.com/rights/louisana.txt


Alambama constitution 1901

SECTION 26

Right to bear arms.

That every citizen has a RIGHT TO BEAR ARMS in defense of himself and the state.
http://www.legislature.state.al.us/CodeOfAlabama/Constitution/1901/CA-245557.htm



Missouri Constitution
Article I
BILL OF RIGHTS
Section 23

August 28, 2003


Right to keep and bear arms--exception.

Section 23. That the RIGHT OF EVERY CITIZEN TO KEEP AND BEAR ARMS in defense of his home, person and property, or when lawfully summoned in aid of the civil power, shall not be questioned; but this shall not justify the wearing of concealed weapons.
Source: Const. of 1875, Art. II, § 17.

http://www.moga.state.mo.us/const/a01023.htm


ARKANSAS DECLARATION OF RIGHTS

(Article II of the 1874 Constitution of Arkansas)
As amended to 1975

Sec. 5. The citizens of this state shall have the RIGHT TO KEEP AND BEAR ARMS for their common defense.

http://www.harbornet.com/rights/arkansas.txt




CONSTITUTION
OF THE
STATE OF TEXAS
(as amended to Aug. 1969)

Sec. 23. Every citizen shall have the RIGHT TO KEEP AND BEAR ARMS in the lawful defense of himself or the State; but the Legislature shall have power: by law, to regulate the wearing of arms, with a view to prevent crime.

http://www.harbornet.com/rights/texas.txt



CONSTITUTION
OF THE
STATE OF OKLAHOMA
Adopted in Convention at Guthrie, July 16, 1907.
Ratified Sept. 17, 1907. In force Nov. 16, 1907.
With Amendments to January 1,1975

ARTICLE II

BILL OF RIGHTS

Sec. 26. The RIGHT OF A CITIZEN TO KEEP AND BEAR ARMS in defence of his home, person, or property, or in aid of the civil power, where thereunto legally summoned, shall never be prohibited; but nothing herein contained shall prevent the Legislature from regulating the carrying of weapons.

http://www.harbornet.com/rights/oklahoma.txt



CONSTITUTION OF THE STATE OF MICHIGAN
(As amended to 1972)

Sec. 6. Every person has a RIGHT TO KEEP AND BEAR ARMS for the defense of himself and the state.

http://www.harbornet.com/rights/michigan.txt



http://www.harbornet.com/rights/illinois.txt

CONSTITUTION OF THE STATE OF ILLINOIS
(as amended to 1970)
Sec. 22. Subject only to the police power, the RIGHT OF THE INDIVIDUAL CITIZEN TO KEEP AND BEAR ARMS shall not be infringed.




THE CONSTITUTION
OF THE
STATE OF OHIO
(as amended to 1974)

Sec. 4. THE PEOPLE HAVE THE RIGHT TO BEAR ARMS for their defence and security; but standing armies, in time of peace, are dangerous to liberty, and shall not be kept up; and the military shall be in strict subordination to the civil power.
http://www.freerepublic.com/perl/post?id=1172715%2C1




CONSTITUTION OF THE STATE OF INDIANA
(as amended to 1972)

Sec. 32. The people shall have a RIGHT TO BEAR ARMS, for the defense of themselves and the State.

http://www.harbornet.com/rights/indiana.txt




WISCONSIN CONSTITUTION
ARTICLE I.
Article I, §25

Article I, §25
Right to keep and bear arms. Section 25. [As created Nov. 1998] The people have the RIGHT TO KEEP AND BEAR ARMS for security, defense, hunting, recreation or any other lawful purpose. [1995 J.R. 27, 1997 J.R. 21, vote November 1998]

http://folio.legis.state.wi.us/cgi-bin/om_isapi.dll?clientID=42804035
==



CONSTITUTION
OF THE
STATE OF SOUTH DAKOTA
(as amended to 1975)

BILL OF RIGHTS


Sec. 24. The RIGHT OF CITIZENS TO BEAR ARMS in defense of themselves and the state shall not be denied.

http://www.harbornet.com/rights/s-dakota.txt





CONSTITUTION OF THE STATE OF MISSISSIPPI
(Adopted Nov. 1, A.D.,1890)

BILL OF RIGHTS

Sec. 12. The RIGHT OF EVERY CITIZEN TO KEEP AND BEAR ARMS in defense of his home, person, or property, or in aid of the civil power when thereto legally summoned, shall not be called in question, but the legislature may regulate or forbid carrying concealed weapons.





Arizona Constitution

Section 26. The RIGHT OF THE INDIVIDUAL CITIZEN TO BEAR ARMS in defense of himself or the State shall not be impaired, but nothing in this section shall be construed as authorizing individuals or corporations to organize, maintain, or employ an armed body of men.

http://www.tufte.net/jerod/law/AZ-Constitution.html



CONSTITUTION
of the
STATE OF OREGON

Bill of Rights

Sec. 27. THE PEOPLE SHALL HAVE THE RIGHT TO BEAR ARMS for the defence (sic) of themselves, and the State, but the military shall be kept in strict subordination to the civil power [.]

http://www.harbornet.com/rights/oregon.txt



Washington Constitution

ARTICLE I

DECLARATION OF RIGHTS

SECTION 24 RIGHT TO BEAR ARMS. The RIGHT OF THE INDIVIDUAL CITIZEN TO BEAR ARMS in defense of himself, or the state, shall not be impaired, but nothing in this section shall be construed as authorizing individuals or corporations to organize, maintain or employ an armed body of men.

http://www.leg.wa.gov/pub/other/WA_CONSTITUTION.htm




Idaho Constitution


Sec. 11. THE PEOPLE SHALL HAVE THE RIGHT TO BEAR ARMS for their security and defense; but the legislature shall regulate the exercise of this right by law.

http://www.harbornet.com/rights/idaho.txt
Utah Constitution



Sec. 6. [Right to bear arms.] THE PEOPLE HAVE THE RIGHT TO BEAR ARMS for their security and defense, but the Legislature may regulate the exercise of this right by law.

http://www.archives.state.ut.us/exhibits/Statehood/1896text.htm
=====


THE CONSTITUTION OF THE STATE OF NEVADA

Article. 1. Declaration of Rights.

Sec. 11. Right to keep and bear arms; civil power supreme.

1. EVERY CITIZEN HAS THE RIGHT TO KEEP AND BEAR ARMS for security and defense, for lawful hunting and recreational use and for other lawful purposes.

2. The military shall be subordinate to the civil power; No standing army shall be maintained by this State in time of peace, and in time of War, no appropriation for a standing army shall be for a longer time than two years.




Hawaii Constitution

ARTICLE I

BILL OF RIGHTS
Sec. 15. A well regulated militia being necessary to the security of a free state, the RIGHT OF THE PEOPLE TO KEEP AND BEAR ARMS shall not be infringed.

http://www.harbornet.com/rights/hawaii.txt



Alaska Constitution


Sec. 19 A well regulated militia being necessary to the security of
a free state, the RIGHT OF THE PEOPLE TO KEEP AND BEAR ARMS
shall not be infringed.

http://www.harbornet.com/rights/alaska.txt


Delaware Constitution


DELAWARE BILL OF RIGHTS

(Article I of the 1897 Constitution of Delaware)
Sec. 20. A PERSON HAS THE RIGHT TO KEEP AND BEAR ARMS for the defense
of self,family, home and state, and for hunting and
recreational use.

http://www.harbornet.com/rights/delaware.txt
-


178 posted on 07/16/2004 4:19:03 PM PDT by bunkerhill7 (that's the facts, jack)
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