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To: beavus

Okay, that's our problem. My definition of "default position" is not the same as yours. I was going on my experience with machines and software. (Just as the FreeRepublic website has "defaults" for subscribers which can be modified). Standard terminology, as is the term "value" and the quoted portion of Dr. Spitzer's philosophy.

While we may start with nothing other than our DNA in a single cell, we do not start *as* nothing. We begin as human beings. Every society of humans has injunctions against killing other humans. While the expression of that value may vary, and while individuals may not know that they should not kill, it is a constant among rational humans. I suspect your true frustration is with this obvious fact. In order to support your view that embryos have no value, you must deny all value.

To paraphrase J. Budzewzewski again, "That's a long way to go to justify killing a few humans."


192 posted on 07/07/2004 7:09:10 PM PDT by hocndoc (Choice is the # 1 killer in the US)
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To: hocndoc
Okay, that's our problem. My definition of "default position" is not the same as yours. I was going on my experience with machines and software. (Just as the FreeRepublic website has "defaults" for subscribers which can be modified). Standard terminology

Reasonable explanation, except the "standard terminology" part. There's nothing standard about it, which is why context and elucidation are important.

While we may start with nothing other than our DNA in a single cell, we do not start *as* nothing. We begin as human beings.

It's hard to justify any such statment using "begin" without sweeping the whole space-time continuum thing under a rug.

Every society of humans has injunctions against killing other humans. While the expression of that value may vary, and while individuals may not know that they should not kill, it is a constant among rational humans.

It's a rare society that hasn't had allowances, and even incentives for killing other humans--war, duals, executions, self-defense, etc. You are very selective about what history shows to be stereotypical among human societies.

I suspect your true frustration is with this obvious fact.

I suspect that you don't really suspect that. And you'll find my frustration much relieved by recognitions such as the one you led with.

In order to support your view that embryos have no value, you must deny all value.

I never said that I didn't value embryos. Even so, this statement is false. Sounds like another example of poetry over substance.

193 posted on 07/09/2004 8:07:16 AM PDT by beavus
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