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Pistol found that killed 8.5 million people
Chicago Sun-Times ^ | June 22, 2004 | KATE CONNOLLY

Posted on 06/22/2004 10:07:58 AM PDT by Chi-townChief

BERLIN -- The Browning pistol that killed Archduke Franz Ferdinand and sparked the crisis leading to World War I has been discovered gathering dust in a Jesuit community house in Austria.

The weapon is going on display in the Vienna Museum of Military History in time for the 90th anniversary of the assassination of the heir to the Austrian empire and his wife, Sophie. Gavrilo Princip, a student from Belgrade, fired seven shots as they were driven through Sarajevo on June 28, 1914.

The shooting led to World War I, which by one estimate resulted in 8.5 million deaths.

For decades the murder weapon, serial number 19074, was in the possession of a community of Jesuits in Styria, southern Austria. They inherited it from a close friend of the archduke and his wife.

A Jesuit priest, Anton Puntigam, gave the couple the last rites and later made public his intention of opening a museum in memory of the archduke. But the chaos of the war foiled his plans.

On the priest's death in 1926, the objects were offered to the archduke's family, which declined to take them. They remained out of sight until recent publicity about the 90th anniversary.

Daily Telegraph


TOPICS: Extended News; Foreign Affairs; Germany; Miscellaneous; News/Current Events
KEYWORDS: austria; balkans; bang; banglist; wwi
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To: nkycincinnatikid; Colorado Doug

Looks like a Spad XIII to me. That IS a great picture! Do you have more?


81 posted on 06/22/2004 7:57:27 PM PDT by Denver Ditdat (Ronald Reagan belongs to the ages now, but we preferred it when he belonged to us.)
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To: nkycincinnatikid
I'm sorry, I just don't know for sure what plane it is. My best guess would be some kind of a Sopwith maybe. He was in the 94th Aero Squadron, so it would have to be something that they flew from time to time. There are some more pics, including Roosevelt's temporary grave behind enemy lines at this link: http://www.1stfighter.org/1stpursuit/Hutchinson.html
82 posted on 06/22/2004 7:59:18 PM PDT by Colorado Doug
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To: nkycincinnatikid
Upon more reflection, I take back my Sopwith guess and say that I haven't a clue unless it's a Curtiss JN-4, "Jenny" or better yet, it look kind of like a Spad XII: http://www.theaerodrome.com/aircraft/france/spad_vii.html
83 posted on 06/22/2004 8:12:09 PM PDT by Colorado Doug
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To: Colorado Doug

Thanks for those links


84 posted on 06/22/2004 8:18:53 PM PDT by nkycincinnatikid
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To: Denver Ditdat
It could be a Spad XIII, in fact, I think you are right it's not a VII but an XIII. I know that we were using those by the end of the war. I should have known that but I was thinking that the famous XIIIs were more angular.

Go to the link at post #82 for more pictures. I will try to get more scanned and on the net soon.

85 posted on 06/22/2004 8:19:40 PM PDT by Colorado Doug
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To: nkycincinnatikid
This is the right plane, compliments of Denver Ditdat: http://www.theaerodrome.com/aircraft/france/spad_xiii.html
86 posted on 06/22/2004 8:22:49 PM PDT by Colorado Doug
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To: nkycincinnatikid; Denver Ditdat

And one Painted up a little flashier: http://www.1stfighter.org/1stpursuit/images_1stpursuit/Circus.jpg


87 posted on 06/22/2004 8:25:25 PM PDT by Colorado Doug
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To: Chi-townChief

Grigori Yefimovich Rasputin

A careful study of Rasputin and the Czar's Russia is also helpful in understanding the winds of war. That was one very interesting time in world history. I recommend The Life and Times of Grigorii Rasputin by Alex DeJong. There are many other good ones as well.

88 posted on 06/22/2004 8:30:03 PM PDT by Lancey Howard
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To: nmh

I'm facinated by the Browning because it's a known firearm that was in a particular place in time. We know for sure exactly where it was almost a hundred years ago. AND IT SURVIVED ALL THOSE YEARS.
If you think it's evil or has some sort of power over you that it must be destroyed, I can't argue with that. You know yourself better than I do.
I wish I knew the history of the firearms I own. One piece I used to own was a rarity of a rarity from the Civil War.


89 posted on 06/22/2004 8:31:01 PM PDT by Shooter 2.5 (Vote a Straight Republican Ballot. Rid the country of dems.)
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To: Shooter 2.5
Inanimate objects are neither good nor bad.

Are books "inanimate"?

90 posted on 06/22/2004 8:32:41 PM PDT by supercat (Why is it that the more "gun safety" laws are passed, the less safe my guns seem?)
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To: nmh
I was through posting to you until this little gem caught my attention.

This PARTICULAR gun is notorious for murdering people.

Seek help.

91 posted on 06/22/2004 8:33:34 PM PDT by Shooter 2.5 (Vote a Straight Republican Ballot. Rid the country of dems.)
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To: Colorado Doug

By the way, what is the statute of limitations on war souvenirs?



If it is full-auto, and it wasn't registered in the 1968 amnesty, it's 10 years in jail, I'm sorry to report.


92 posted on 06/22/2004 8:34:33 PM PDT by Atlas Sneezed (Your Friendly Freeper Patent Attorney)
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To: Denver Ditdat; nkycincinnatikid

I just checked my hard drive and I do have some that I don't think have been posted anywhere yet. Freepmail me with your email and I will send you some, if you would like.


93 posted on 06/22/2004 8:36:38 PM PDT by Colorado Doug
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To: supercat

# [adj] appearing dead; not breathing or having no perceptible pulse; "an inanimate body"; "pulseless and dead"
# [adj] not endowed with life; "the inorganic world is inanimate"; "inanimate objects"; "dead stones"
# [adj] (linguistics) belonging to the class of nouns denoting nonliving things; "the word `car' is inanimate"


94 posted on 06/22/2004 8:54:09 PM PDT by Shooter 2.5 (Vote a Straight Republican Ballot. Rid the country of dems.)
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To: Colorado Doug

Great links. Thanks!


95 posted on 06/22/2004 9:08:39 PM PDT by Denver Ditdat (Ronald Reagan belongs to the ages now, but we preferred it when he belonged to us.)
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To: nkycincinnatikid

I think it was Göring that said: "When I hear the word, culture, I reach for my revolver."


96 posted on 06/22/2004 9:15:59 PM PDT by Doctor Stochastic (Vegetabilisch = chaotisch is der Charakter der Modernen. - Friedrich Schlegel)
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To: El Sordo

Otto von Bismarck's comment about the nature of the region in question is germane: "another (delete expletive here) thing in the Balkans." Imagine a place where people name a bridge after an assaassin.


97 posted on 06/22/2004 9:24:28 PM PDT by 185JHP ( "Who is this King of Glory? The Lord strong and mighty, invincible in battle.")
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To: Beelzebubba

I guess I'm glad this flintlock isn't even semi-auto.


98 posted on 06/22/2004 10:10:48 PM PDT by Colorado Doug
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To: Shooter 2.5

By those definitions, a book would appear inanimate; nonetheless, I would posit that it is possible for books to possess moral character (good or evil) in and of themselves. While it may be possible to use an evil book for good purposes or a good book for evil purposes, I would posit that does not prevent some books from being inherently good and others inherently evil.


99 posted on 06/23/2004 12:36:48 AM PDT by supercat (Why is it that the more "gun safety" laws are passed, the less safe my guns seem?)
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To: Lancey Howard
A careful study of Rasputin and the Czar's Russia is also helpful in understanding the winds of war. That was one very interesting time in world history. I recommend The Life and Times of Grigorii Rasputin by Alex DeJong. There are many other good ones as well.

I learned in school that it was the assassination which started the war, but aside from a vague explanation that nations started lining up behind their allies and then everyone fought, I never quite understood how one lead to the other. Do you know of a good book which explains this well?

100 posted on 06/23/2004 12:48:14 AM PDT by Dianna
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