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To: betty boop
...It is not "immoral" to establish [constitutionally] when an embryo becomes developed enough to have equal rights to the pregnant woman that bears it....
In the USA we solve such dilemmas by the logical rule of constitutional law...

On "rule of men" grounds, perhaps not; but our Constitution (as already noted) establishes a rule of law.

Betty, you're simply making an unsupported circular argument, claiming that your view of our Constitution on abortion trumps the USSC's. You need to reread our basic documents on the issue, imo.

261 posted on 06/15/2004 4:07:25 PM PDT by tpaine (The line dividing good and evil cuts through the heart of every human being" -- Solzhenitsyn)
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To: tpaine
Betty, you're simply making an unsupported circular argument, claiming that your view of our Constitution on abortion trumps the USSC's. You need to reread our basic documents on the issue, imo.

tpaine, you're missing the point. The Constitution itself is totally silent on the issue of abortion law; all it says is that it is the duty of government (to the full extent of the powers delegated to it by the people) to guarantee and protect the life, liberty, and property of its citizens, and that it must afford equal protection of the laws to all its citizens.

My argument is well supported (I can give you more), and it hardly seems circular in its reasoning to me. For I start with the Constitution, understand what the Framers were up to, try to lay some of that information on the table here as evidence, and then draw some logical conclusions.

You say my "view" does not "trump" USSC's.

Well kiddo, who's working for whom here? Who made USSC my "master?" If they do their job right -- under the Constitution -- then I have no grievance at all. But the fact remains: I have a grievance, and it is because they are entirely beyond the restraint of constitutional jurisprudence these days, and have been so for nigh on 40 years by now, maybe more.

So if the Constitution can't restrain them, and it seems they will not restrain themselves -- then what, o fellow citizen???

There is a difference between "my" view and that of the "bare majority" of the SCOTUS justices who gave us Roe v. Wade -- usurping the authority of the people in the process. And that is: Unlike these justices, I love my country, our rule of law as founded in the Constitution (that is to say, in the thoughts and values of the Framers/Founders), our glorious and honorable American traditions -- and our historical experience together as one people, one nation, "under God," going clear back to the early seventeenth century....

Good grief, tpaine -- did you sleep through all of last week? If you ever wanted to see our great American values and traditions on immaculate display, Ronald Reagan's memorial week was incomparably the best time to do it -- 21-gun salutes; Ruffles and Flourishes; Hail to the Chief; The Battle Hymn of the Republic; Amazing Grace; Ave Maria (Schubert); the Missing Man Formation; "Black Jack," the riderless horse with Ronald Reagan's personal riding boots in the stirrups (facing backwards, of course); the eight-horse funeral cortege; the lying in state (respose) at the Capitol; the invocation from T. S. Eliot (from his play Murder in the Cathedral) at the State Funeral on Wednesday; taps; bagpipes; The Lord's Prayer; religious ceremonial...and so forth.

tpaine, what you saw last week was AMERICA. And the rest of the world saw it, too. I'm proud to be an American. For some strange reason, I find it eerie to find you (of all people) standing on the side of the Supreme Court, and not on the side of a fellow patriot. FWIW.

263 posted on 06/15/2004 4:57:26 PM PDT by betty boop (The purpose of marriage is to civilize men, protect women, and raise children. -- William Bennett)
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