Posted on 06/04/2004 4:48:14 PM PDT by Ernest_at_the_Beach
ROME (AP) -
President Bush got a sharp dose of Europe's opposition to his Iraq policy Friday, quietly in the halls of the Vatican from Pope John Paul II and loudly in the streets of Rome from thousands of demonstrators.
The ailing pontiff complained about recent "deplorable events," an apparent reference to the abuse of Iraqi prisoners by U.S. troops. In the absence of a commitment to shared human values, "neither war nor terrorism will ever be overcome," he said, struggling to speak.
However, the pope welcomed the recent establishment of an interim government and called for a speedy transfer of sovereignty to the Iraqis.
Not far from the Vatican walls, tens of thousands of protesters took to the streets to demonstrate through central Rome, many with signs demanding Italy withdraw its troops from Iraq. A score of demonstrators hurling stones clashed with police during the march. Others threw firecrackers and set a trash can on fire.
Bush had dinner with a top ally on Iraq, Italian Prime Minister Silvio Berlusconi. On Saturday, the president heads to Paris to meet with one of his sharpest war critics, French President Jacques Chirac.
Despite Berlusconi's backing, and his decision to send 3,000 Italian troops to Iraq, polls show that a majority of Italians oppose the U.S.-led war and occupation of Iraq, a sentiment common throughout western Europe.
Bush is on a three-day trip to Italy and France to help commemorate the June 1944 liberation of Rome and the allied D-Day invasion of Normandy. He was also using the trip - and an international economic summit next week in Sea Island, Ga. - to try to build more support among leading nations for a new U.N. resolution to deal with post-occupation Iraq.
But the announcement in Baghdad that five U.S. soldiers were killed and five wounded on Friday when their vehicles were attacked in east Baghdad served as a reminder that Iraq remained an extremely dangerous place.
Seated next to the pope, Bush promised his nation would work for "human liberty and human dignity," without making any reference to Iraq. He presented the pontiff with the presidential medal of freedom, America's highest civilian award, calling him "a devoted servant of God."
The president and his wife Laura laid a green wreath at the Ardeatine Cave Memorial, where Nazi occupiers massacred 335 Italian citizens in 1944. Bush, alone, approached the wreath, straightened its blue ribbon and bowed his head as a bugler played.
At the Vatican, Bush sat impassively as the 84-year-old pope, seated in front of a microphone, read his statement in English in a voice that was audible, but not easily understood. His hands trembled from Parkinson's disease.
"Mr. President, your visit to Rome takes place at a moment of great concern for the continuing situation of grave unrest in the Middle East, both in Iraq and in the Holy Land," the pope said.
"In the past few weeks, other deplorable events have come to light which have troubled the civic and religious conscience of all."
Although the remarks appeared directed at abuses of Iraqi prisoners by U.S. troops at Baghdad's Abu Ghraib prison, they could also be taken to include other atrocities such as the kidnapping of foreign civilians in Iraq by Islamic militants and the beheading of an American contractor.
The pope did not elaborate. Neither would papal spokesman Joaquin Navarro-Valls, although he did not dispute characterizations that the comments referred primarily to abuse at Abu Ghraib prison.
The spokesman said that while the pope had reiterated the Vatican's long-standing opposition to the war, he made plain he was ready to move forward.
Later, Navarro-Valls issued a brief statement summing up Bush's visit to the Vatican. "There were some points of agreement, especially regarding the process of normalization of Iraq," he said.
Navarro-Valls also spoke about the U.S. humanitarian role around the world, particularly in Africa, and, as the pope himself had stated, the promotion of moral values in American society.
White House spokesman Scott McClellan said, "We appreciate the Holy Father's words of support for the interim government and for the transfer of sovereignty."
Regarding the pope's apparent reference to Abu Ghraib, McClellan said, "I'm sure the Holy Father is concerned about the abuses. The president is as well. That's why we are acting, taking a systemic look at the prison system and holding those responsible who committed those atrocities."
Friday's was Bush's third meeting with the pope since he became president.
Bush has aggressively courted Roman Catholic voters - a bloc making up about a quarter of the electorate that split evenly between Bush and Democrat Al Gore in 2000.
Thanking Bush for the medal of freedom award, the pontiff said: "God bless America."
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Our eyes do not deceive us; we in
America can tell this man is very
old, sick, frail & being taken
care of by others. Even Catholics,
which I am not, know he makes no
claim of infallibility unless he
speaks "ex cathedra", which he did
not.
Our ears do not deceive us. The
words out of the Pope & Vatican,
reported by the Media, sound just
like the Left-Wing slams we hear
every day against Bush. Except a
bit more mild, as noted.
I would guess that we intuitively
"get it" pretty well.
Bush seemed unafraid, decent &
kind in his visit to the Pope.
Not going through with this would
have been worse by far, IMO.
No kidding. We started taking care of the Iraqi abuse problem a hell of a lot sooner than the Church took care of the child abuse problem. I never thought I say this about a pope but I like what you said, "Thanks for nothing." This pope treats America like a red-headed step child. We got rid of a brutal dictator, we brought freedom to 25 million Iraqis at the cost of 700 hundred American lives and all he can do is feel sorry from some murdering terrorist who had ladies panties put on his head. It makes me furious. Put a sock in it your Holiness.
No kidding. We started taking care of the Iraqi abuse problem a hell of a lot sooner than the Church took care of the child abuse problem. I never thought I say this about a pope but I like what you said, "Thanks for nothing." This pope treats America like a red-headed step child. We got rid of a brutal dictator, we brought freedom to 25 million Iraqis at the cost of 700 hundred American lives and all he can do is feel sorry from some murdering terrorist who had ladies panties put on his head. It makes me furious. Put a sock in it your Holiness.
I've read these various articles, and it seems to me that it's 99% media spin and about 1% John Paul II. We don't really know what he said to Bush privately, and the spin on what he says publicly seems typical of the outright lies that have been emanating from the media for the past 5 or 6 months.
No facts. Plenty of media spin.
The Pope & his crew need to work on the plank in the eye of the Church before criticizing the President for trying to bring democracy to Iraq. Where was the Pope when Saddam was shredding people? or gassing people? or whacking off hands? or raping little girls?
Oh, Fox News has that answer for you - they said privately, the Pope was even harsher with Bush. That's Fox News.
More hypocracy from the Church. Its obvious the Pope is in no condition to expound on world events except through the prompting of surrogate Cardinals that seem to have a vendetta against the United States while struggling to hide their pedophiles. The evil these pedophile priests committed on young children is worse than what those ignorant prison guards did by a factor beyond calculation.
With as badly as things have gone in Iraq of late, Bush should be DOWN 15-20%.
The fact that he's not says much about how Americans feel about him, and about how rotten Kerry is as a candidate.
things are not going that badly in Iraq - that's part of the media lies also.
There is a lot of Media spin for sure.
well, your last sentence is a bit much. Was the Vatican supposed to send their army against the Panzers?
The Ashcroft/Ridge business is just manufactured to me. If it had been a Democrat administration it never would have come to public attention (and I saw no "back peddling: I saw the media trying to portray it that way.) This really gets to the heart of my point: what is to be done about this sort of coordinated attack? Remember that the fucntioningFederal bureaucracy is in the thrall of the Democrat Party. Is the administration to spend all of its energies on media news cycles? That is what Clinton did for 8 years and look where that got us. There is a war to fight.
Again, it ultimately comes down to the maturity of the American people. Bush seems to have an great deal of faith in us. Do we deserve it?
I imagine that thy have some sort of war room, the real question is if the strategy of going for select grass roots issues and organizations and side stepping the national media will work. We will not know this until election day. One gathers that Bush and Co. have come to this tack from observation of the Reagan administration. The difference is that Reagan spoke over the media to the American people and Bush speaks "around the media," as it were, to the nation. I think that this is because Reagan was after all an accomplished actor and was once a media insider. The media was also more balanced then and had a somewhat more sober understanding of its obligations.
I for one am glad he is not doing interviews twice a week. first, it would dilute his message , and second, he give terrible interviews when the interviewer is hostile. I think his strategy of giving the hostile interviews early in the campaign was wise. Perhaps now he can sneak in one or two friendly ones.
Lastly, to fire Rove now would be a PR disaster an would probably cost him the election.
Rove as got him this far, he should stick with him now.
I agree about McClellan. I do not understand it. It may be that there is not a single competent person in the entire GOP that wants this job. I certainly would not want it.
We have not had a starker choice since the Civil war and the danger to the nation is no less than that time either. We are at a cultural cross roads. The nation may not be able to take the right road and there may be little that Bush can do about it.
It may be beyond politics or media. This media war against the president is unprecedented. We are so inured to it that we do not see this or grasp just how scandalous and grave it truly is.
With all the bad news from Iraq and constant bashing by the liberal media, Bush should be way behind Kerry in the polls.
The fact that it is 50/50 shows Bush's solid base of support EVEN when everything seems to be against him.
I believe things can only improve for Bush as November approaches and he wins reelection.
Certainly seems like it.
he should be doing interviews with Rush and Hannity et al each week - friendly forums. Our side has to do what it can to build up the so-called "alternative" media, since we have no hope of getting anything except lies and distortion from the mainstream media. He ought to do Letterman also. Bring Rollins in, don't fire Rove, let him make coffee in the war room.
Well the Pope certainly has the courage to condemn the leader of the world's ONLY superpower for a supposedly "immoral" war removing Saddam.
Why couldn't the Catholic church do the same regarding Hitler who murdered millions of Jews in Europe? Where were they then? Hypocrites.
they were in the middle of one of the Axis powers - surrounded by the Nazis.
Advice for Bush on the election
In his re-election campaign, Bush is fighting a two front war: one against the Democrats and one against the false perceptions being created by the mainstream media – lead by the New York Times, which has turned its newsroom into the journalistic party of opposition.
..............................See Link for the rest of the article.
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