Posted on 06/03/2004 12:18:21 PM PDT by 2nd_Amendment_Defender
Sorry, wrong. I had a Ford minivan. It suffered pre-ignition on regular gas in the heat. Hi octane cured it.
That's because their engines are designed to use the higher-octane fuel. Indeed, certain high-performance street vehicles demand high-octane fuel for the same reason. But if your car's documentation does not specifically call for high-octane fuel, and your engine isn't knocking with the low-octane stuff, the high-octane will do nothing but cost you more.
There is a difference in the fuel they sell you (even though they all come from the same refinery), it's just you don't need the high octane unless you drive a chevette. (or a high horsepower race car, where racing gas is a slightly different blend with very high octane for racing reasons)
If you buy 87 octane, you get 87 octane. If you buy 93, it's guaranteed to be 93. if you get the mid grade, it is only a mix of the 2 grades, because refineries usually only produce the 2 grades.
If one wants, you can get reprogrammed controllers for engines to change performance. A quick Google can find it. Say for a Volkwagen Jetta 1.8T engine. It's quite popular these days.
They need that stuff to avoid pre-ignition. NASCAR cars run at much higher RPMs than passenger vehicles. The engines run much hotter too. They need to make sure that the fuel doesn't explode the second its injected into the combustion chamber and starts to get compressed. High-octane prevents pre-ignition (thats what causes knocking) and a NASCAR engine is prone to that problem because of high heat and RPM.
High compression engines, like that used in NASCAR, do need the different solution.
Also, the Northstar engines that were (are still?) in some of the Cadillacs require the added octane. Again, a high compression engine, designed to get more horsepower out of a smaller displacement.
Is there are difference in gasolines? Well, here in Cali-phony-a, there sure is! If you can get to a Union 76 station, they use ethanol as an oxygenator, instead of MTBE. I do notice a slight bump in mileage and power when I use the ethanol-based gasoline, but it's not real significant (maybe 1%).
That's not true either.
Some car models (primarily sports and luxury cars) have high-performance engines that are designed for and REQUIRE the higher octane fuel. Using the lower octane fuel results in preignition (causing "knocks" and "pings") that can damage the engine.
The good news is that 80% of the cars sold in our country do NOT require this premium grade of gasoline.
READ YOUR OWNER'S MANUAL and follow the manufacturer's recommendation for the octane rating of the fuel you should use.
It's up to the consumer what gas they put in their tank. I have never seen a gas co Nazi standing by the pumps making sure you buy the higher octane, nor do they make you use "full service".
Just like the tobacco companies, drug companies, the oil companies are soooo easy to blame.
You should just be thankful our cars don't run on bottled water, that would cost us 3 to 4 times as much as gasoline.
The info you provided is useful, BUT contending that somehow we're getting ripped off is a slap in the face of the free enterprise system.
During the 90's when oil was $10 a barrel and oil cos were having to consolidate just to stay alive NOBODY complained, of course.
I'm just sick of comsumers griping about gas prices. We have the CHEAPEST GAS in the free world(that includes sizable taxes.)
Cheap gas is not a birthright nor is it in the Constitution.
OUCH! I paid $1.89 today.
My only point is that no one's being "ripped off," as far as I know. If people buy premium because of the neato name, that's their problem. I've never, ever had anyone try to sell me premium gasoline as opposed to regular.
"Essentially, the built up crud inside the engine forces the fuel/air mixture inside each cylinder to get squished into a smaller volume, raising the compression ratio"
Do any of those STP or other brand cleaners really help on that crud?
No one's forcing anyone to buy the Extra or Premium, so no one's getting "ripped off." You sound like one of them there liberals masquerading as a conservative...
This doesn't even scratch the SURFACE on how bad they're ripping us off. Here in D.C., gas prices are around $2.10 per gallon. Are you aware that the price per barrel of oil in the U.S. is the EXACT same as it was in 1991 ($40 per barrel)? Does anyone here remember what gas prices were in 1991?
Now let's consider for a moment what this means to our "struggling" economy... If I am a farmer, and I produce milk, much of my machinery runs on Gas, which has doubled the cost of running it in the past few years. Then I have to ship that milk at an increased expense, since the trucks carrying it take, surprisingly enough, Gas. So now my milk has to reflect all of these additional costs that are on me, and the price of milk from my farm goes up. The resaler/packaging plant gets the milk, and guess what they use to run their packaging plant/trucks? Did you guess Gas? Good. So now they have to add THEIR additional costs into the cost of the packaged/homogonized milk they send out. Finally, it's sent to the store who, guess what? Uses gas for THEIR trucks/delieveries, and thus THEIR costs have gone up, too! This is ALSO reflected in the price of the milk. So low and behold, the price of milk has skyrocketed, for no reason other than the fact that the price of GAS has skyrocketed.
Now, milk was just used here as an example. You can substitute any product in place of it and get the same outcome. Worse still, the products most effected are those that are necessities (bread, milk, foodstuffs, etc.)
So now you're joe blow consumer. Your cost of living has gone through the roof because you still need to get to work. It now costs you TWICE what it did just a few years ago, just to drive to work. This is a strain on your pocketbook... However, to make matters worse, if you're lucky you might have been getting your 6% raise for the past few years to try and keep up with inflation. However, because of the price of gas, products such as milk, eggs, bread, etc. have increased in price at an astounding rate of 23% per year. This is nearly four times faster than your salary. Thus, you have less, and less money to spend as time goes on.
What happens when the consumers have less money to spend? Do they eat less bread? Drink less milk? Drive to work less often? Of course not. They stop buying things they don't absolutely NEED. Luxury items. Half of the stuff you own can be considered luxury. Radios, TV's, Computers, big beds, camping gear, you name it. As people quit buying these things, the businesses that produce them go OUT of business, or cut back, and lay off employees (sound familiar?)
Now what happens when you have a bunch of people looking for jobs that can't find them? They start taking jobs at lower rates just so they can HAVE a job. The job market has a sudden glut of people willing to work for lower wages, so the average salary drops dramatically. And what happens when the people are making LESS money while inflation is at the highest rate it's been at since the great depression? (This is a rhetorical question.)
They have less money to spend, so more businesses go out of business, creating more workers, and fewer jobs, so the salaries drop again, and the cycle continues until you're in a depression. And all of this just so a few big-wigs in five major gasoline companies can line their pockets and sit comfortably knowing that they'll be living high on the hog when the depression hits.
Normally, I'd say the Government doesn't belong in private business, but I consider major depressions to be a matter of national security. This is a case where the government NEEDS to step in, and THEY need to set a maximum amount of profit that the gas companies are allowed to make. Why are we paying more than DOUBLE for a gallon of gas when the price is the same as it was in '91?
-Javin
Gas companies are laughing themselves all the way to the bank.
WTH are you talking about? Who forces you, or anyone else, to pay for gas you don't need?
No they are different, just the benefit of that difference is marginal at best in most makes of cars. Octane like this article points out, is just how much compression the gas can take before it explodes... ideally you don't want the gas exploding until the spark plug fires, for optimal performance, if the gas explodes prematurely its a waste of energy.
However again, most cars it means nothing. There are a few cars that have recommended octains that are higher, but they are very very few and far between.
Gas has no difference because the gas that comes out of one end of the gas pipline is not related to the gas going in at the other... its the same product no matter who refined it.
IE Exxon wants 10,000 gallons in Texas... it puts 10,000 gallons into the pipeline in NJ. That same day EXXON takes 10,000 out in Texas... its not remotely the same 10,000 gallons that exxon put in, but it doesn't matter... then Exxon takes its tanker and adds some detergents to the gas and delivers it to its gas stations. Exxon has absolutely no idea which refinery refined the 10,000 gallons it just distributed, and has no idea which company will get the 10,000 gallons they put into the pipeline either.
Smart @$$ comment aside, my wife drives a 2004 Grand Cherokee and I have a 2004 Jeep Wrangler Rubicon. We use 87 grade in both and I have experienced no pinging yet. We will go on vacation next week to Montana and Wyoming. They don't sell 87 much there, it is mostly that 85 grade stuff. I have used the 85 grade over there instead of 87 and had no problems.
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