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To: CWOJackson; Laverne; Destro; McGavin999; MHGinTN; wirestripper

"Great record...getting our sailors slaughtered for political purposes."

Guess you didn't even pay attention to the Congressional hearings. There are only TWO other places that US navy ships can refuel between the Persian Gulf and the Med. One is Jeddah, in Saudi Arabia, and the other is Djibouti. And both of them were rated as equally dangerous. Look at the Congressional hearings HERE:

http://www.pbs.org/newshour/bb/military/july-dec00/aden_10-19.html

Evidently you are the one who is missing out on history. The USS Cole was struck in October 2000. General Zinni gave up CentCom to General Franks in July 2000.

So like a true man of accountability, General Zinni passes the buck to no one (unlike certain Pentagon leaders currently). General Zinni will freely admit that it was he who organized the refueling contract in the previous years - and that it was a choice out of many bad locations. But it was General Franks who was at the helm when the Cole conducted refueling operations in October of 2000.

Now, why didn't we have more refueling ships? Because of the drawdowns by Bush I and Cheney which resulted in our fleet being decimated. These cuts were continued by Clinton, but it was Cheney who started the worldwide decline of our naval forces.

BTW, Did you know Zinni voted for Bush in 2000?

As far as Zinni being an egomaniacal patsy, that's Bullsh*t. Plain and simple. General Zinni is a proven combat leader, and he's got the time (and awards) in Vietnam to prove it. He was always a straightforward hard charger.

That's why he intially supported the Bush Administration, and was rewarded with the post of Bush's special envoy to the Mideast in November 2001: he was a straightshooter, and an honest broker. He could be trusted by the Bush Administration, and by the Israelis and Palestinians as well.

Schwarzkopf, Webb and Van Riper all come out on Zinni's side in this disastrous Iraqi campaign. I guess their cowards in your eyes too. At least they have one thing that you lack: their INTEGRITY.


116 posted on 05/23/2004 4:25:43 PM PDT by Veracious Poet (Cash cows are sacred in America...GOT MILKED???)
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To: Veracious Poet
As far as Zinni being an egomaniacal patsy, that's Bullsh*t. Plain and simple. General Zinni is a proven combat leader, and he's got the time (and awards) in Vietnam to prove it. He was always a straightforward hard charger.

That is what they used to say about Gen. McCaffery. Remember? Then he screwed up and disobeyed Schwarzkopf during the 'left-hook' maneuver during the first Gulf war, then he screwed up again at the 'highway of death', lost all credibility and went and hid under Bill Clinton's skirt.

Zinni WAS a warrior. When he screwed up, he signed on with those who would best protect him.

118 posted on 05/23/2004 4:36:09 PM PDT by Pukin Dog (Sans Reproache)
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To: Veracious Poet
Integrity means that you support your commander and chief, and you don't put your troops in harms way by giving the enemy a reason to think you lack resolve. At the very least you stay the hell out of the way.

What Zinni is doing is referred to as patriotism by the left.

Treachery by me and anyone else who believes our cause is just.

119 posted on 05/23/2004 4:36:44 PM PDT by Cold Heat (Lex et Liberatas......Semper Vigilo, Paratus, et Fidelis!)
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To: Veracious Poet
He could be trusted by the Bush Administration, and by the Israelis

The Israelis most certanly did not and do not trust Zinni.

120 posted on 05/23/2004 4:37:38 PM PDT by Numbers Guy
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To: Veracious Poet
That's you opinion, and you are entitled to it. It is not mine. Integrity is missing when you go to the media while we have men in battle. Sorry, that's just the way I see it.

He is not exactly a strategic genius if all of this was building up under his command and he didn't go to the press then.

123 posted on 05/23/2004 4:53:13 PM PDT by McGavin999 (If Kerry can't deal with the "Republican Attack Machine" how is he going to deal with Al Qaeda)
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To: Veracious Poet
Schwarzkopf, Webb...And these two people, especially Webb for me, have bonafides that are untouchable. Webb is as close to a perfect man as you're ever going to find. My admiration for him is immeaureable.
125 posted on 05/23/2004 4:57:32 PM PDT by AlbionGirl ("E meglio lavorare con qui non ti paga, e no ha parlare con qui non ti capisce!")
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To: Veracious Poet

LOL!. Perhaps you should read Zinni's own words...where he takes full responsibility for making the decision which resulted in the Cole disaster...of course he's probably lying.


128 posted on 05/23/2004 5:07:54 PM PDT by CWOJackson
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To: Veracious Poet

Much of what you say is true...but be careful not to exagerate.

Those you mention are not against President Bush...they, like most, say we did some things right and some things wrong. Wow. What else is new in war? Last I heard Schwarzkopf was getting set to campaign for Bush. Have you heard something different? If he is campaigning for Bush in this election, then you may have overstated your case.

And Webb and Van Riper? Any links to whom they said they would support?

And your point about the ships being cut out by Bush Sr and Cheney. Again, don't get carried away here. Bush and Cheney did in fact cut the military after the end of the Cold War. But Clinton took those cuts and drove them much, much deeper...at least in the Army. Many of us believe the levels Bush Sr planned are about right in today's world. Those cuts that Clinton added to the original cuts are what many of us see is where the problem came from.

Do you have any specifics on ships? I am much more knowledgable on the ground forces than Navy numbers.


185 posted on 05/23/2004 6:58:30 PM PDT by Proud Legions
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