Parents of Terri Schindler-Schiavo Told to Pay to See Their Daughter

The Terri Schindler Foundation ^ | May 7, 2004 | Terri Foundation

[William Terrell]

Yes, all I can do is speak for myself. And all anyone else can do is speak for themselves. Yes, there is doubt. I'd say there is always doubt about any case unless there is clear evidence. That's why we have jury trials.

When I post my opinions, I come out of my fears, thoughts, considerations and beliefs about justice, fairness, and the effect of law on the people, of which I'm one.

When I look at this controversy, my judgment is, whether true or not, that all the others that post on this subject are doing the same. I'm sorry, I might be wrong, but I don't see much concern for Terri herself.

I see reactions to events centered around Terri and the use of Terri politically to address those events. And see this camouflaged as love and caring for Terri. Maybe I'm out of line, but, God help me, it angers me to see this.

Maybe there can be justice in this case. How, can you tell me, will the doubt be removed? The events will keep on regardless of my opinion. But I, before God, will express them, and I haven't seen one reason to abate them.

I'll tell you this. Beyond my considerations in this matter, I personally believe the Mr. Shiavo is trying to avoid a personal responsibility to his wife he accepted before God when he married her, and he is using the rights that matrimony gives him from centuries of English and American law to do it.

I'm not talking about confusing statutes that states enact for money and power. I talking about ancient common law that has worked for our cultures for a very, very long time. I'm talking about this because I'm a conservative.

Over the centuries, we have benefited from these laws and customs built up around marriage and personal relationships. There is always bad people that use good laws to further their own ends. I see that these customs are challenged at their core by the egregiousness of one case.

This is what I see. The common law must survive a bad man and a bad judge for the good of all. The common law was changed in just such a manner to allow nofault divorce without having to have a clear cause, and that is helping mightily to destroy this culture, the one in which I live and depend on for security.

Right or wrong, That's what I think. And I'll face all the farmers with pitchforks in the country to say it. The blessings of Christ to your and yours also.

[Ohioan from Florida]

Which is why Jeb's attorney asked that Baird be recused from the case, but no, the answer was, no.

[Krodg]

Which is why Jeb's attorney asked that Baird be recused from the case, but no, the answer was, no.

Who ruled on that one?

[Concerned]

WILLIAL TERRELL WROTE: "...Is this about what is the best for Terri or what is best for her parents. It has been done time and again, once a person concedes one legal point, immediate lawsuits are filed to proceed with others. Maybe Mr. Shiavo is concerned with that. I would be. This is why there are a lack of apologies on the slavery reparations issue.

Terri's parents' are concerned that Terri's health, safety and even LIFE are at stake! Her parents WANT her and WANT to remove her from danger.

On the other hand, Terri's "loving"-Hitleresque-lying-adultering-possibly-attepmted-murderer-"husband"-in-name-only is giving ALL signs of attempting to KILL her to keep her QUIET so she cannot TELL what REALLY happened to her that fateful night long ago and in the year after that when she suffered BROKEN BONES all over her body.

I'm sure Michael is concerned with THE DEATH PENALTY if Terri should ever get the $750,000 of THERAPY that HE got for HER THERAPY after telling the JURY (i.e. under oath) that he loved Terri and wanted to help her the rest of his life---never ONCE mentioning during THAT lawsuit that she "wanted to die."

WILLIAL TERRELL ADDED: "And perhaps Mr. Shiavo really believes Terri would want to die. That you don't believe him from evidence meaningful to you is worth no more than anyone else's opinion about and view of that same evidence.

What Mr. Schiavo claims he believes Terri wants and what Terri actually wants are likely to be two different things. If Terri did not make a FULLY INFORMED Advanced Directive (which she did not), he has no business being allowed to KILL her via removal of food.

As the mother of a severely mentally and physically disabled daughter, I can tell you---FIRST HAND---that parents of disabled children LOVE their children even though they are disabled!

Terri's parents WANT to take Terri even without getting the $750,000 that Michael Schiavo apparently DEFRAUDED a court out of when he CONVENIENTLY FAILED to mention Terri's alleged claim to want to die while he ALSO claimed he was wanting to get the $750,000 for Terri's THERAPY.

Terri's parents have ONLY Terri's safety, health and LIFE in mind. "Loving"-Hitleresque-adulterer-husband ONLY wants to KEEP the apparently FRAUDULENTLY-gained money AND keep from getting the DEATH PENALTY if Terri ever regains her ability to TELL what happened.

[Concerned]

WILLIAL TERRELL WROTE: "...Is this about what is the best for Terri or what is best for her parents. It has been done time and again, once a person concedes one legal point, immediate lawsuits are filed to proceed with others. Maybe Mr. Shiavo is concerned with that. I would be. This is why there are a lack of apologies on the slavery reparations issue.

Terri's parents' are concerned that Terri's health, safety and even LIFE are at stake! Her parents WANT her and WANT to remove her from danger.

On the other hand, Terri's "loving"-Hitleresque-lying-adultering-possibly-attepmted-murderer-"husband"-in-name-only is giving ALL signs of attempting to KILL her to keep her QUIET so she cannot TELL what REALLY happened to her that fateful night long ago and in the year after that when she suffered BROKEN BONES all over her body.

I'm sure Michael is concerned with THE DEATH PENALTY if Terri should ever get the $750,000 of THERAPY that HE got for HER THERAPY after telling the JURY (i.e. under oath) that he loved Terri and wanted to help her the rest of his life---never ONCE mentioning during THAT lawsuit that she "wanted to die."

WILLIAL TERRELL ADDED: "And perhaps Mr. Shiavo really believes Terri would want to die. That you don't believe him from evidence meaningful to you is worth no more than anyone else's opinion about and view of that same evidence.

What Mr. Schiavo claims he believes Terri wants and what Terri actually wants are likely to be two different things. If Terri did not make a FULLY INFORMED Advanced Directive (which she did not), he has no business being allowed to KILL her via removal of food.

As the mother of a severely mentally and physically disabled daughter, I can tell you---FIRST HAND---that parents of disabled children LOVE their children even though they are disabled!

Terri's parents WANT to take Terri even without getting the $750,000 that Michael Schiavo apparently DEFRAUDED a court out of when he CONVENIENTLY FAILED to mention Terri's alleged claim to want to die while he ALSO claimed he was wanting to get the $750,000 for Terri's THERAPY.

Terri's parents have ONLY Terri's safety, health and LIFE in mind. "Loving"-Hitleresque-adulterer-husband ONLY wants to KEEP the apparently FRAUDULENTLY-gained money AND keep from getting the DEATH PENALTY if Terri ever regains her ability to TELL what happened.

[floriduh voter]

Of course it's baloney in our favorite Sixth Judicial Circuit. Please visit www.conservative-spirit.org for some encouraging news on the front page.

[William Terrell]

I took care of my brain damaged mother for 5 years and destroyed my career to do it, although I benefited in other ways. I know something about the matter. Thank you for accurately reproducing my posts.

Michael Shiavo is more than likely a criminal in his heart, but he has the backing of law, and common law. God will judge him when human law can't.

[Ohioan from Florida]

You are wrong to assume that there is no concern for Terri herself just because you choose not to see it that way.

You said, "I see reactions to events centered around Terri and the use of Terri politically to address those events. And see this camouflaged as love and caring for Terri. Maybe I'm out of line, but, God help me, it angers me to see this." This is exactly what I feel, too, but perhaps from a different perspective.

I see Michael having impure motivations for doing this to Terri, camouflaged as love and caring. If he really loved Terri, he wouldn't have procreated two children with the woman he's living with out-of-wedlock. If he really loved Terri, and cared for her, he would give her the best of care, including dental cleanings twice a year. He would allow her to have range of motion therapy. He would allow her to have swallow tests. He would allow her parents and family to see her free of charge. If he loved Terri, he would let her be wheeled out into the fresh air or to go to an exotic bird show. He would allow her stimulation of a variety of sorts. I wouldn't wish his type of love and caring on my greatest enemy.

I see a fame and money hungry lawyer (Felos) going after his next kill. He would be a two-bit lawyer if it weren't for the notoriety of the Estelle Browning case, in which he made a name for himself.

I see a judge, who very well may be incompetent to be doing the important job he's been allowed to do for the last several years. His motivation for continuing to rule as he does has more to do with admitting that he has overlooked many laws to begin with, and so now has to cover that up by continuing to do the unethical thing. He has had ample opportunity to fess up and to let someone else take the case over, but he thinks he is being more honorable by sticking with it.

Finally, I see a group of pro-euthanasia advocates within the hospice industry, tainting the true mission of the hospice movement. It's possible they were there all along, pushing this agenda to kill off people who are helpless, and "we" just didn't see their masquerade. Hospice says it's there to help deal with the end-of-life. That doesn't necessarily mean we should be pushing people over the edge.

It angers me to see Terri being used in this way. She is a real person and has a real value, even if only truly known by God Himself. But the fact that Terri is a sister to me as a child of God, well, I care about who she is and how she feels, even if what she feels is far different than anything I know or have experienced.

What I can tell you is that when I was younger, I didn't think that I'd want to live an imperfect life, but as I got older I realized that none of us lives a perfect life. We get what we get, sometimes of our own doing. There have been times where I have gone through quite a bit of pain and suffering, sometimes physical and sometimes mental, and now that I'm past that people say, "How'd you ever make it through that?" And I can't tell them except for the grace of God. It was tough, but not impossible. It wasn't much fun, but it wasn't always dismal. I spent a lot of time in prayer.

I think it's possible that Terri is able to endure her ordeal so far, because God is with her in a special way. Maybe even in a way so special that we here on Earth don't/can't understand unless God gives us the grace to understand.

I care about Terri because she is a sister to me, a sister in Christ, another of God's children. I wouldn't want what's happening to Terri to happen to any other person, including her husband, his lawyer, or the judges. The laws in Florida have been written so that this SHOULDN'T be happening to Terri, but they are. So how do we get the laws of Florida to be executed properly? You'd think that Judge Greer should be able to handle this, but in fact, he may truly be incompetent. Why isn't he taking care of his own paperwork? He should never have let this get to this point, but since he has, there must be some legal way to remedy this situation. This is wrong, and it really doesn't matter to me if there are laws saying Michael can do this. There are plenty of laws that say he can't. Now what do the common people do?

[Ohioan from Florida]

Baird himself.

[William Terrell]

Well, actually, the common people are doing what the common people can do. All I can do is pray that their efforts aren't used to further destroy the common law about marriage any more than it already has.

[William Terrell]

This poster you are referring to has nerve to even mention the erosion of constitutional protections, while calling for a fellow human being to be cruelly put to death.

As you said in your private reply this statemnt should be discussed publicly since you stated it publicly. Good.

First of all, reproduce the post where I said I a fellow human being should be put to death.

Second, I admit I can't see any relationship between the two concepts, so you should explain it to me.

[TheSpottedOwl]

You gave me a choice to debate a statement I made either in public or private. As I indicated to you, I prefer public since I made this statement in public.

This poster you are referring to has nerve to even mention the erosion of constitutional protections, while calling for a fellow human being to be cruelly put to death.

Prison inmates are constitutionally protected from cruel and unusual punishment. When the state executes criminals, they are given lethal injection for the most part, because activists consider the electric chair cruel.

We have heard of several people who were brain aware of what was happening to them, although doctors and loved ones didn't realize this. One woman wrote a book about her experience being starved and dehydrated. God helped this woman muster enough strength to make the doctor and nurses take notice. There have been other instances of this. Talk about cruel and unusual punishment. These people went through agony.

The reason why we all feel so strongly about Terri is that she does respond, and that her family and independent specialists are deliberately being prevented from helping her. Her husband is determined to kill her. This is murder, and she has a constitutional right to be protected. This is a very disturbing situation. Here we have a woman who was injured under suspicious circumstances. Her husband lied about her care needs to win a fat malpractice suit and a medical trust fund. All of a sudden he remembers that Terri wouldn't want to be kept alive on machines.

Terri's parents have offered to let Michael Schiavo keep the money and just divorce her. Think about it William. This man has had a relationship with a woman that has produced 2 children. Why not just divorce Terri? We may be on different sides of the basic issue, but there is nothing basic about this, and if you'd really take a look at the evidence, I think you'd see there is something else going on disgused as a right to die issue.

I believe in appropriate care until natural death. Sometimes family members go overboard when it is clear that their loved one is brain dead. All Terri has is a feeding tube. It is comfort care, not technically life support. She isn't brain dead, she responds and there is video to support that fact.

Our constitution and the rights they provide are being challenged in many different areas. This is the slippery slope. If Michael Schiavo gets away with murder, none of us, including you William will be safe.

[tutstar]

That's great news. You know? I was told that Felos used Sen King's statement that he regretted voting for Terri's law during part of the court proceedings.

What I'm about to say would qualify as a 'tin foil hat' theory to some but it seems to be a little clearer to me how this is playing out.

All the anti-Terri statements from Senator King have been to media 'outside his district' but near the area where the case is being tried.

Felos is tied to hospice, Greer has a tie to hospice through a colleague, Jim King is tied to hospice. Jim King is determined to keep the statutes just as they are. He knows there is little to no coverage of any of this in his district and that is why he will make such comments in that area freely because the scene has already been set to push the pro-death agenda in that area. I doubt very seriously that the decisions that have been made in Terri's case would have come down the same way here in Jax, could be wrong but don't think I am.

Look who made a contribution to King's campaign in 1999, Jerger & Sons

King Jr, James E. "Jim" (REP)(STS) 01/20/1999 500.00 CHE
JERGER & SONS INC
7785 66TH ST N
PINELLAS PARK, FL 33781

I looked up Jerger at Sunbiz.org
and found this
MOBILE ADJUSTMENT COMPANY
Richard M Jerger Jr. (the same name as listed on Jerger & Centonze Insurance & the address matches the one which was used for the campaign contribution to King)
PRINCIPAL ADDRESS
7785 66TH ST N
PINELLAS PARK FL 34664-8080 US

There are other businesses listed under Richard Jerger Sr which also list Jerger Jr as an agent.

Why were they donating to King when they aren't even living in his district?

[TheSpottedOwl]

Reproduce the post? Good Lord, lol it will take me all day. Well Terri is being put to death in the cruelest fashion. It's one thing to keep a terminal patient comfortable and let God take over, quite another to starve someone to death.

We rely on judges to follow the law, not their personal convictions. When their person convictions outweigh their duty to uphold the law, the recipient of such conduct is being denied basic civil rights that are supposedly guaranteed under the Constitution.

I hope that offers some kind of explaination between the issues.

I am truly sorry to hear about your mom, and how it affected you. Taking care of a disabled family member can take its toll.

You have to understand that people have deliberately come to this site to cause all kinds of trouble. Most of us don't go to sites and forums that we disagree with. There's been a lot of monkey business going on around here, and when you're dealing with a controversial situation complete with judges who won't follow the law, one can get pretty edgy.

[iowamomforfreedom]

Wow, nice catch tutstar!

[FR_addict]

For those that missed the petitiion thread:

Remove Florida Senator Jim King from Office Petition
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1132398/posts

[floriduh voter]

TO PROTECT HIS LEGACY so that the happy couple could starve the innocent wife. Ya think that they are "concerned" when Tom Lee takes over in the fall? You betcha.

That's why we help Terri whether she's IN CRISIS OR JUST BEING HELD HOSTAGE.

The news media has supressed this story as much as possible or switched the stories to markets based probably on their wink and nod relationships with the likes of people like JIM KING. If it's about him and it's good, Jax news covers. If it's about this HORRID DEATH BUSINESS, a complete news blackout.

[floriduh voter]

William Terrell aka apple guy said he was done posting on Terri threads and then he re-emerged. BUT THE LITTLE BLUE APPLE hasn't returned with him. Of course this is one troll I'm way over. I think his posts are confusing on purpose to disrupt and get us off track from our purpose here which is to help save Terri which will help save thousands, millions, billions and trillions of Terris yet to be.

Read my tag line, visit my web site home page today. I have good news there...

[tutstar]

here's another $500.00 to
King from

500.00 CHE
THE JEGER COMPANY INC
78TH AVE & 66TH STREET NORTH
PINEALLAS PARK, FL 34664

It is misspelled at the Div Elect site but you can pull it up at Sunbiz with the correct spelling. There are no Jergers listed as agent,officer, or director for this business but there are
Raymond Blacklidge 100.00
Steve Beaty 500.00

who also made individual contributions to Sen King

and the address appears to be the same location as the other donation I posted,
Can anyone from the area, or someone with time to check mapquest verify if this is the same location

[floriduh voter]

"That's why we have jury trials."

You should know by NOW THAT TERRI HASN'T HAD EVEN ONE JURY TRIAL. SHE HAS RETAINED RIGHTS BUT THEY'VE BEEN STEPPED ON OVER AND OVER AND OVER. There's absolutely no excuse for the way her guardianship file has been handled, the way her rehab money more than likely went up somebody's nose.

Life isn't fair but it SHOULD BE JUST. Terri deserves JUSTICE and she's had NO JURY TRIALS. Even Governor Bush isn't afforded the rights of a Defendant in Schiavo v. Bush, Judge W. Douglas Baird presiding. JUDGE BAIRD IS NO JURY, HE'S ANOTHER JUDGE who's had every Sam Seltzer Steak that he's ever ordered but STARVING SOMEONE because Judge Greer doesn't want anyone to ruin the "Terri FORCED EXIT PLAN" is JUST WRONG, ILLEGAL, A SIN AND IMMORAL.

Get your Living Will but when you say "poor Terri", that's Felos-speak. If you live in Dunedin, Florida, I have no doubts that you are a neighbor or friend of HINO's attorney.

If you went to him for your Living Will, God help you. The man should be disbarred in my opinion. There are better and other Estate Law attorneys in this major metropolitan area.

And finally, "nearing 60" is nothing to be afraid of. If you held strong religious beliefs, you'd have no fear, you'd have FAITH.