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Iraqi Prisoner Abuse Appears More Extensive
The L.A. Times ^ | May 2, 2004 | T. Christian Miller

Posted on 05/03/2004 4:41:10 PM PDT by Tolerance Sucks Rocks

WASHINGTON — At least one Iraqi prisoner died after interrogation, some were threatened with attack dogs and others were kept naked in tiny cells without running water or ventilation, according to an account written by a military police sergeant who is one of six U.S. soldiers charged in a growing scandal over prisoner abuse in Iraq.

The account of Staff Sgt. Ivan "Chip" Frederick II, along with interviews Saturday with other soldiers in Frederick's unit and senior U.S. and military officials, paints a portrait of a prison that spun out of control last fall as thousands of captured Iraqis poured into its razor-wire confines.

In some cases, as few as a dozen U.S. soldiers were responsible for overseeing more than 1,000 prisoners. Escape attempts were common. Mortar fire from insurgents rained down on prison grounds, killing U.S. guards and Iraqi prisoners.

Relatives of Frederick, who faces court-martial in connection with the alleged sexual and physical degradation of prisoners in Iraq, gave The Times a copy of the account that they said was handwritten by Frederick shortly after his arrest in January.

Frederick, 37, wrote that U.S. intelligence officers and civilian contractors who were conducting interrogations urged military police at the Abu Ghraib prison west of Baghdad to take steps to make prisoners more responsive to questioning.

Military intelligence officers have "encouraged us, and told us, 'great job,' that they were now getting positive results and information," he said in the neatly written 10-page document that covers a two-week period of last fall.

One U.S. official said 50 to 100 Iraqis had died in U.S. custody during the last year, victims of mortar attacks, heat exhaustion, wounds suffered in battles and attacks by other prisoners.

Although Frederick said one prisoner died after interrogation, the official said that so far no such allegations had been independently substantiated. He said the deaths from other causes amounted to a small percentage of the estimated 35,000 Iraqis who had spent time in U.S. detention centers.

Still, he said that the abuse allegations and other evidence showed that Iraqi prisoners had suffered under U.S. custody.

"There was a mentality that the people we're in charge of are not humans," the U.S. official said. "That's not consistent with our values. The people who were doing this lost it."

The New Yorker magazine reported Saturday that it had obtained a 53-page U.S. military report that concluded that Iraqi prisoners had been subjected to "sadistic, blatant and wanton criminal abuses" at the prison, which before last year's U.S.-led invasion had been Saddam Hussein's primary killing ground for political enemies.

The author of the report, identified by the New Yorker as Army Maj. Gen. Antonio M. Taguba, said it appeared that some of the inmates had been beaten and sodomized, perhaps with a broomstick or a chemical light.

(Excerpt) Read more at latimes.com ...


TOPICS: News/Current Events; War on Terror
KEYWORDS: abuse; attackdogs; iraqipow; prisoners; sodomy
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I hope we clean up our act. If the abuse is becoming as widespread as one friend of mine claims, then perhaps it is time to bow out of Iraq.
1 posted on 05/03/2004 4:41:11 PM PDT by Tolerance Sucks Rocks
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To: Tolerance Sucks Rocks
In all fairness, I've read on FR that the veracity of the pictures of British abuse is in question.
2 posted on 05/03/2004 4:44:01 PM PDT by Tolerance Sucks Rocks (Good evening. I'm Sydney Biddle-Barrows, and welcome to Whore Stories!)
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To: Tolerance Sucks Rocks
LA Times article...I'll wait for more info.

3 posted on 05/03/2004 4:44:07 PM PDT by debg
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To: Tolerance Sucks Rocks
perhaps it is time to bow out of Iraq.

30 Jun. By then the military will have done all it can do. After that, who knows.

4 posted on 05/03/2004 4:45:04 PM PDT by RightWhale (Destroy the dark; restore the light)
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To: Tolerance Sucks Rocks
I hope we clean up our act. If the abuse is becoming as widespread as one friend of mine claims, then perhaps it is time to bow out of Iraq.

If somebody pisses in your beer you don't dump out the keg...you just get another beer. Bow out my ass.

5 posted on 05/03/2004 4:47:37 PM PDT by antaresequity
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To: Tolerance Sucks Rocks
I hope we clean up our act. If the abuse is becoming as widespread as one friend of mine claims, then perhaps it is time to bow out of Iraq.

The abuse has nothing to do with our reasons for being in Iraq, but they certainly complicate our mission there. All of those directly culpable must be prosecuted including all officers who knew or should have known. Heads must roll as far up the chain of command as necessary. This kind of garbage should never be tolerated, nor should it have any impact on our timetables and withdrawal decisions.

6 posted on 05/03/2004 4:52:18 PM PDT by MACVSOG68
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To: RightWhale
30 Jun. By then the military will have done all it can do. After that, who knows.

Uh... Our military is not leaving on June 30th. We will have a security arrangement that will include our military enforcing the new government.

7 posted on 05/03/2004 4:52:56 PM PDT by SunStar (Democrats piss me off!)
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To: Tolerance Sucks Rocks
So, one friend telling you it's a "horror show" out there suggests that everyone else from President Bush through the top brass is "lying"? It's not time to bow out of Iraq.
8 posted on 05/03/2004 4:53:33 PM PDT by Alia (California -- It's Groovy! Baby!)
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To: antaresequity
"If somebody pisses in your beer you don't dump out the keg...you just get another beer. Bow out my ass."

Absolutely.

There is always that 10%.
9 posted on 05/03/2004 4:56:08 PM PDT by kddid
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To: Tolerance Sucks Rocks
I am against prisoner abuse but I do think people are over reacting. Just look at the prisons in that part of the country and how our guys are getting killed for entertainment. Some freak on the weekend talk shows suggested that the the attacks on civilians and troops were because Iraqis didn't have enought jobs.
10 posted on 05/03/2004 4:57:20 PM PDT by dalebert
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To: Tolerance Sucks Rocks
There just are NO rules when Americans are captured and tortured by Iraqis, so until then, I will not worry about it.
11 posted on 05/03/2004 4:58:46 PM PDT by tessalu
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To: tessalu
So the standard we hold ourselves to is the absolute lowest standard held by anyone, anywhere? Thanks, but no thanks--I don't want to sink to the level of jihaddi scum.
12 posted on 05/03/2004 5:01:12 PM PDT by johnfrink
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To: Tolerance Sucks Rocks
Throw me a bone here, so they were abused a little , worse things happen in our US prisons.
Media Hype and Puffed Up Propaganda
They were not even tortured in the true sense of the definition , did they have to listen to rap music ? or were their fingers cut off ?
13 posted on 05/03/2004 5:01:15 PM PDT by Freesofar (vicariously micromanaging reality from the safety of my keyboard,)
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To: SunStar
Sure, while gradually uninvolving our military, extricating ourselves from active security as the Iraqis take over. Some of the bases will stay for a long time. Even Kerry or Hillary wouldn't be able to completely shut down the ME bases.
14 posted on 05/03/2004 5:02:47 PM PDT by RightWhale (Destroy the dark; restore the light)
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To: MACVSOG68
The abuse has nothing to do with our reasons for being in Iraq, but they certainly complicate our mission there.

A business associate of mine has a son over there, a young lieutenant who emails him often, and he in turn passes them on to those of us who want to keep track of the situation, and to penpal with his son. Here's what I got today:

"Here is my unsolicited, low level take on this: Those horrible events and pictures are DEVASTATING to our mission here. 12 months of rebuilding and good gestures have been completely reversed by 6 people. They did to those prisoners what we told the world we were liberating Iraq from - at the same FRICKING location Saddam's gang tortured their prisoners at! It makes us all sick that they did that. While there are 140,000 of us here in uniform doing our best, those 6 have really, really hurt this mission. And don't get me wrong, many Iraqis know that this was just 6 people doing this. But our enemies will use those pictures for years against us. But things like this can't and won't affect what we do here on a daily basis. But everyone sure talks about it a lot."

I have a feeling that by the time the investigations are over, it will be way more than six.

15 posted on 05/03/2004 5:03:04 PM PDT by hunter112
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To: tessalu
Americans are burned and dragged through the streets and killed in Iraq, and the culprits are not even dealt with.
Sadr is holed up and allowed to carry on, for the USA is afraid that they might make some devils mad! But they were born mad! The Devils tell the Americans that their buildings are "holy", and the Americans are stupid enough to believe them. Do not come to our "holy" city, they say, or we are goind to get mad! Americans leaders fall in line.
No wonder we are not doing so well in this war, for we are acting like idiots.
16 posted on 05/03/2004 5:05:11 PM PDT by tessalu
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To: dalebert
the attacks on civilians and troops were because Iraqis didn't have enought jobs.

There is something to that. Some percentage of the attackers would have been out of work and got hired as mercenaries. 5%? 10%?

17 posted on 05/03/2004 5:06:13 PM PDT by RightWhale (Destroy the dark; restore the light)
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To: hunter112
our enemies will use those pictures for years against us.

True, even if the White House as Commander in Chief turns the military upside down to resolve this.

18 posted on 05/03/2004 5:08:30 PM PDT by RightWhale (Destroy the dark; restore the light)
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To: dalebert
I agree. This incident happened over a year ago, right? Over a year ago, all the talk was about the pictures of our guys being mutilated and tormented. It was probably playing on some of our guys minds.

I believe these pictures were held back by the media for that reason.

19 posted on 05/03/2004 5:15:48 PM PDT by monkeywrench
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To: Tolerance Sucks Rocks
I have a difficult time accepting defeatism by reading an article detailing events that are still under investigation.

Who would have thought it would only take some photos and a dozen of our own to cause many to fold like a cheap suit under pressure.
20 posted on 05/03/2004 5:16:12 PM PDT by swheats
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