Clarifications on the Case for Free Trade

Ludwig von Mises Institute ^ | 4/12/04 | Paul Craig Roberts

[GOP_1900AD]

The best way to avoid too much of the wrong kind of involvement by the government (e.g. the kind promoted by the DNC) is to proactively snatch the entire issue away from the Left by renewing the McKinley platform.

[fooman]

Which is what?

What were the five key points here?

[Havoc]

Some may miss the ref to Atlas Shrugged here. It is very easy to fall down slippery slope of government intervention here.

Of all the uneducated, dishonest... LOOK, if the government acts and makes a mess - to say government intervention isn't the answer because you like the destruction so long as you get to profit from it is no more than deciet and ambulance chasing. Of course nobody with any profit motive wants the government to intervene - would stop the gravy train and the ransacking of the middle class.

[Cronos]

We were doing fine up to the point this free trade crap kicked in.

We were a free trade nation, freely selling our goods to the rest of the world, making money and becoming the richest nation on the planet while the rest of the world played the dumb game of socialism. Well, now they've learnt and are aping us, so we have real competition now.

[Cronos]

There is no basis on which to say what you're saying other that the free traitor dream of destructive profiteering

Again you come up with rhetoric instead of questions or answers. There is no such thing as a free traitor, the only traitors are those that want to pervert our nations freedoms and impose communist style legislation. This has been proven to ruin nations -- see China and India who went socialist while Japan and S. Korea turned capitalist and are now first world nations as is Singapore. If you impose sanctions and shut off the country to the outside you'll end up with a larger version of Cuba or North Korea.

[Cronos]

You guys will mutter anything if it convinces people to let you destroy people and our economy so you can further enrich yourselves. That's something our constitution and government are supposed to protect us from - it's called tyranny.

Yes, I'm glad we agree on the fact that our government should protect us from tyranny, especially tyrannical governments with excessive legislation and taxes and tariffs.

[Cronos]

No, that's a lie. This country has historically grown due to it's own innovation, work ethic and standard trade with other nations. Free trade came about under Nafta.

Standard trade -- we traded with other nations because we had folks who innovated, we still have them and that's why we're great.

[Cronos]

PBS documentary if memory serves. I can't tell you the name of it, so guess you'll have to go do your homework and satisfy yourselfYou can't make extravagant claims with nothing to back it up but hearsay.

[Cronos]

We were and ARE a free trade nation, freely selling our goods to the rest of the world, making money and becoming the richest nation on the planet while the rest of the world played the dumb game of socialism. Well, now they've learnt and are aping us, so we have real competition now.

[Cronos]

They just did a special on an american within the last six months who visited india, was kidnapped, tried and jailed on trumped up charges and was extorted for every cent they could get out of him until he was finally able to escape.

Links? Proof of trumped up charges? And even more importantly, proof that this is the norm and not an unusual error?

[Cronos]

because you like the destruction so long as you get to profit from it is no more than deciet and ambulance chasing

Tsk tsk Havoc, how can you make baseless accusations against fooman?

[Havoc]

We were a free trade nation, freely selling our goods to the rest of the world,

Oh, no. No. Not getting by with it. If you want to correct yourself, then correct yourself; but, "free trade" in this thread and in this country has specific meaning. This country has never engaged in Free trade prior to recent days with the signing of Nafta and the uprising of globalist horsehockey. Free trade was utterly and completely absent from the mix of things that made us a great nation. And it seems designed to hand the product of our blood sweat and tears to the world in exchange for plattitudes that the world is one and happy as long as we become a third world nation again and enrich a few jerks at the top in the process. Correct it, don't handwring.

[Cronos]

This country has never engaged in Free trade prior to recent days with the signing of Nafta and the uprising of globalist horsehockey

Not really, we became a great nation through trade, free trade with the rest of the world. That's why American companies dominate the top 100 companies in the world.

[ninenot]

the only traitors are those that want to pervert our nations freedoms and impose communist style legislation.

Like Hamilton (Alex.), Jackson, Lincoln, and McKinley?

THOSE Commies?

I suggest that you should do better than Clueless George Bush--namecalling really isn't a good way to make friends.

[ninenot]

Where do you GET this crock about "free trade since forever?"

The USA used tariffs through about the late 1920's, dropped them (errantly) when FDR came to office.

We then destroyed the industrial base of Germany and Austria, while the Germans did the same to England and France. We destroyed Japan's.

Since 1955 or so (until WTO/NAFTA/MFN) we have used tariffs, and STILL use them against countries who are NOT WTO members.

[Cronos]

I suggest that you should do better than Clueless George Bush--namecalling really isn't a good way to make friends.

Where DO you get off insulting our President???

[Cronos]

I suggest that you should do better than Clueless George Bush--namecalling really isn't a good way to make friends.
post # 235. There's no use debating with commie union dimocrats

[sarcasm]

We were and ARE a free trade nation,

Aren't you an Indian?

[Havoc]

You sit and lie openly and boldly on this thread and have the pretense and gaul to go after someone for presumeably insulting Bush. Being clueless isn't an insult it's a happenstance with regards to all this free trade crap. And it's accurate. The man seems otherwise brilliant and adept.

But there you sit lying through your teeth as boldly as if you were Geobels - and yet, aren't you that little Catholic Ankle biter that presents "cover fire" in religious debate by flooding affective debators with endless tangientials.. Yeah, I think you are. You know the tactic, when the group is at a disadvantage, bury the guy doing the damage in questions and attempt to swamp him - while burying the thread history in nonsense so that newcomers enter and don't see the damage previously inflicted. Standard tactic for unethical types.

Tell me, how do you square bald face lies with the priest when you're so good at it and show absolutely no sign that it's any more difficult than clipping your toenails. Are their any Catholics present who think this is proper? I don't agree at all with Catholic Doctrine; but, I've a lot of Catholic friends and fantastic Catholic Coworkers because like most people their pretty decent folks. Wrong; but, good decent folks. Anybody care to privately take this poor misguided soul aside and correct him - privately of course - no need to make a scene lol.

[GOP_1900AD]

1. Bilaterally negoitated trade with nations who we decide we want to trade with (but no overarching, global mandate or standardization). 2. Extremely strong military. 3. Actual expansion of US territory. 4. Gold standard. 5. No nations from Europe (or Asia) messing around in our hemisphere.