An Open letter to President Bush (End run vs. Outsourcing)

Me | Me

[XBob]

ah, I didn't figure that you knew what median means. You are so ignorant on other things.

[XBob]

how ever, it's still a grand idea, we could raise our 'average' IQ if you left.

[Toddsterpatriot]

Make what? Our factories are moving to china - we export nothing to them. The trade deficit is now $500 billion per year. We don't export enough to make any money, because we don't make anything anymore, for use here or for export.

Yeah, those wacky Chinese. Sending us computers and stuff at WalMart and never buying anything with the green paper we send them. They must be below the median IQ.

[Toddsterpatriot]

The government will do what it will but the corporation exists to make a profit, not to make you or government happy.

dear clueless - for the umpteenth time, corporations only exist to make a profit within the rules that the government sets.

Yes comrade, I understand. So if the government makes it impossible to make a profit, the corporation should just take it?

[Toddsterpatriot]

336 - I just bought a new pair of glasses. I tried to get some American made frames. Apparently we no longer make glasses in this country.

At 5 places I went, they only had Japanese, Chinese and Korean frames. No one had seen any american frames in years.

So - if we have a war with the orient, we go blind, as we have no glasses factories in this country.

Well, if it's a matter of national security we must immediately restrict imports of foreign eyeglass frames.

The damn Chinese probably bug the frames they sell us now. We need an immediate government program to reduce our dependence on Chinese frames.

I have to go to sleep now. All this laughing is really wearing me out.

Happy Easter.

[XBob]

343 - "Yeah, those wacky Chinese. Sending us computers and stuff at WalMart and never buying anything with the green paper we send them."

they are buying our corporations and lots of other stuff, here in the US. do a search for China america chamber of commerce and find out how many hundreds of billions of our property they already own in the US.

They are buying your bosses. And buying you.

[Havoc]

Yes comrade, I understand. So if the government makes it impossible to make a profit, the corporation should just take it?

My company did just fine making a profit before all this free trade crap. That's flat nonsense - it's a strawman argument made up for use in handwringing. Outsourcing is the present cause of what you protest. Corporations can't compete with companies overseas paying 1/3 - 1/10th the rate in wages paid here. You free traitor types created that environment. And has been pointed out countless times on this thread, Japanese companies competing under our rules, regs, laws, constituional rights & protections with a competitive wage have had ZERO problem making a profit here. I'd suggest, perhaps, changing your strategy to not include bs that insults the intelligence of everyone here.

[Asclepius]

So - I've been through it, training, and training, and retraining and retraining.

Indeed. [You have had | are having] a really cool, interesting life. A challenging life, yes, but I admire your ability to grow and change and adapt.

[A. Pole]

The government will do what it will but the corporation exists to make a profit, not to make you or government happy.

WRONG! Corporations are CREATED by the legal system in order to BENEFIT the whole society. Otherwise, why not to require the PERSONAL and CONCRETE responsibility for all business and non business operations in the uniform manner? Then the legal fiction/cover of the corporations could be removed from the real individuals.

And if you think that the main objective of the corporations is to profit then another question arises - whose profit? Of the owners/shareholders or personal gain of the decision makers (like CEOs)?

[1rudeboy]

Read a lot of [M]arx do you?

That's so funny. Let me summarize the argument:

A: Marx was in favor of free-trade!
B: Because he felt it would antagonize the proletariat.
A: Yes it is! You're a Marxist!
B: But the only one agreeing with Marx is you.
A: Read a lot of Marx, haven't you?

[ARCADIA]

Indeed. [You have had | are having] a really cool, interesting life.

An ancient Oriental curse:
May You Lead an Interesting Life.

How appropriate.

[Toddsterpatriot]

they are buying our corporations and lots of other stuff, here in the US. do a search for China america chamber of commerce and find out how many hundreds of billions of our property they already own in the US.

Oh no!! How long before they own the whole country???

[Toddsterpatriot]

WRONG! Corporations are CREATED by the legal system in order to BENEFIT the whole society.

And government gets to decide what benefits society?

I just got a socialist chill up my spine.

[Toddsterpatriot]

Corporations can't compete with companies overseas paying 1/3 - 1/10th the rate in wages paid here.

So, we should seal the borders? Allow no foreign goods?

Sorry you're losing your job. Good luck finding another, but if your search depends on your understanding of economics or foreign exchange, you're in for a long disappointing time.

[ARCADIA]

So if the government makes it impossible to make a profit, the corporation should just take it?

These guys sound like somebody is asking them to produce results in solitary confinement. A company that fails to produce results within a market spanning 3.6 million square miles, 290,000,000 highly educated people, rich in natural resources, with good infrastructure, and a stable government; is a company that should go out of business. I would say to them the same that they would say to us: adapt or die.

[ARCADIA]

I just got a socialist chill up my spine.

As long as a hobnailed boot isn't attached, you are fine.

[A. Pole]

[A. Pole:] WRONG! Corporations are CREATED by the legal system in order to BENEFIT the whole society.

[Toddsterpatriot:] And government gets to decide what benefits society? I just got a socialist chill up my spine.

Red herring. It is a simple FACT that corporation is a legal construct and not the living actual persons who get benefits from hiding behind the curtain. Are you against personal responsibility? :)

You do not want government/legal intervention, fine - then get rid of the corporations altogether. But you want privileges without obligations.

[discostu]

I didn't say corporations have rights, I said they have a duty, and only one duty. The duty to make PROFIT, and where ever they need to go to make profit that's where they should go. And if they can't make profit in America then WE need to fix that situation and make America a profitable place for corporations again. The main problem with protectionism is that it assumes that if you make going someplace other than America non-profitable that will magically make being in America profitable again. That's not how it works, if America isn't a profitable place for a company to be, and America makes it unprofitable to be someplace else, you now have no place a company can be profitable, and that company goes away.

[discostu]

No, if we go to war with the orient we retool some metal shops to make glasses frames. The actual lenses get made in America (often times right in the place where you got the exam... ever actually look around a LensCrafters), it's just the frames (the least expensive, least technical part of a pair of glasses) that we don't bother to make here because there's no reason. Or we switch to contacts (made in the same place as the lenses generally). Or eye surgery (hard to offshore that).

The problem with all the "if we go to war" scenarios is they all assume we can't retool existing factories. That is a silly assumption that completely ignores how America behaved in every previous war.

[discostu]

Well they'll have to buy it from the Japanese. By figures much touted in the mid-80s the Japanese bought all of America like 6 years ago... but wait the Japanese don't own all of America... you mean the doom and gloomers were WRONG?!

Shocked, I'm simply shocked.