Posted on 04/05/2004 6:33:24 AM PDT by crushkerry
Often times we joke or make light of Sen. Kerry and his positions. But there is no way to make what follows funny. It is the trial testimony from the ongoing court cases dealing with the partial birth abortion ban. As we have mentioned previously, voting against the ban was one of the few issues Sen. Kerry has bothered to show up to vote on over the last six months.
After reading this testimony, from the actual doctors who perform partial birth abortions, we wonder how Sen. Kerry, or anyone with a soul, could support this savagery. It is utterly inhuman.
The testimony is long, gruesome, and nearly impossible to read without vomiting, crying, and screaming all at the same time. Someone in the media has to ask Senator Kerry about his support for this procedure, which only someone like Dr. Mengele could appreciate.
Again, we want to warn you before you click on the rest of the story that it is not for the faint of heart. The testimony speaks louder than any further commentary we could provide.
Q. Did you make any observation of the way the physician performing that intact D&E effected the incision into the skull?
A. In the situations that I have observed, they either -- actually, the procedures that I have observed, they all used a crushing instrument to deliver the head, and they did it under direct vision.
Q. Thank you, Doctor.
THE COURT: Can you explain to me what that means.
THE WITNESS: What they did was they delivered the fetus intact until the head was still trapped behind the cervix, and then they reached up and crushed the head in order to deliver it through the cervix.
THE COURT: What did they utilize to crush the head?
THE WITNESS: An instrument, a large pair of forceps that have a round, serrated edge at the end of it, so that they were able to bring them together and crush the head between the ends of the instrument.
THE COURT: Like the cracker they use to crack a lobster shell, serrated edge?
THE WITNESS: No.
THE COURT: Describe it for me.
THE WITNESS: It would be like the end of tongs that are combined that you use to pick up salad. So they would be articulated in the center and you could move one end, and there would be a branch at the center. The instruments are thick enough and heavy enough that you can actually grasp and crush with those instruments as if you were picking up salad or picking up anything with --
THE COURT: Except here you are crushing the head of a baby.
THE WITNESS: Correct.
~
THE COURT: An affidavit I saw earlier said sometimes, I take it, the fetus is alive until they crush the skull?
THE WITNESS: That's correct, yes, sir.
THE COURT: In one affidavit I saw attached earlier in this proceeding, were the fingers of the baby opening and closing?
THE WITNESS: It would depend where the hands were and whether or not you could see them.
THE COURT: Were they in some instances?
THE WITNESS: Not that I remember. I don't think I have ever looked at the hands.
THE COURT: Were the feet moving?
THE WITNESS: Feet could be moving, yes.
~
THE COURT: If you are all finished let me just ask you a couple questions, Dr. Johnson. I heard you talk a lot today about dismemberment D&E procedure, second trimester; :does the fetus feel pain?
THE WITNESS: I don't know. I don't know of any -- I can't answer your question. I don't know of any scientific evidence one way or the other.
THE COURT: Does it ever cross your mind when you are doing a dismemberment?
THE COURT: Simple question, Doctor. Does it cross your mind?
THE WITNESS: Does the fetus having pain cross your mind?
THE COURT: Yes.
THE WITNESS: No.
THE COURT: Never crossed your mind.
THE WITNESS: No.
THE COURT: And do you explain what is involved like in D&E, the dismemberment variation? Do you tell her that?
THE WITNESS: We would describe the procedure, yes.
THE COURT: So you tell her the arms and legs are pulled off. I mean, that's what I want to know, do you tell her?
THE WITNESS: We tell her the baby, the fetus is dismembered as part of the procedure, yes.
THE COURT: You are going to remove parts of her baby.
THE WITNESS: Correct.
THE COURT: And although you have never done an intact D&E, do you know whether or not the incision of the scissors in the base of the skull of the baby, whether that hurts?
THE WITNESS: Well, I guess my response would be I think that the baby feels it but I'm not sure how pain registers on the brain at that gestational age. I'm not sure how a fetus at 20 weeks or 22 weeks processes and understands pain.
THE COURT: Did you ever participate with another doctor describing it to a woman considering such an abortion?
THE WITNESS: Yes. And the description would be, I would think, descriptive of what was going to be, what was going to happen; the description.
THE COURT: Including sucking the brain out of the skull?
THE WITNESS: I don't think we would use those terms. I think we would probably use a term like decompression of the skull or reducing the contents of the skull.
THE COURT: Make it nice and palatable so that they wouldn't understand what it's all about?
THE WITNESS: No. I think we want them to understand what it's all about but it's -- I think it's -- I guess I would say that whenever we describe medical procedures we try to do it in a way that's not offensive or gruesome or overly graphic for patients.
THE COURT: Can they fully comprehend unless you do? Not all of these mothers are Rhodes scholars or highly educated, are they?
THE WITNESS: No, that's true. But I'm also not exactly sure what using terminology like sucking the brains out would --
THE COURT: That's what happens, doesn't it?
THE WITNESS: Well, in some situations that might happen. There are different ways that an after-coming head could be dealt with but that is one way of describing it.
THE COURT: Isn't that what actually happens? You do Use a suction device, right?
THE WITNESS: Well, there are physicians who do that procedure who use a suction device to evacuate the intercranial
~
Excerpts from NAF's direct examination of Dr. Cassing Hammond:
THE COURT: Do you tell them what happens when they do an intact D&E?
THE WITNESS: If the patient --
THE COURT: The brain is sucked out?
THE WITNESS: Well I don't -- as a point of fact, your Honor, I don't usually do the suction part. I do compress the calvarium and I do some other procedures. I don't actually do suction so I don't explain that part.
THE COURT: You don't explain that to them?
THE WITNESS: Well I explain the method.
THE COURT: You explain what a compression of the calvarium is?
THE WITNESS: Yes, sir; that I do explain.
THE COURT: That that's crushing the skull?
THE WITNESS: I explain that, yes.
~
Q. Doctor, when you do have an intact extraction and the head gets stuck at the cervical os and then you do something to bring the head out, you testified on direct that sometimes the fetus is alive before you open the skull?
A. Yes.
Q. Right. How can you tell? What signs of life are there?
A. Well, as I think I stated in my testimony, these fetuses are grossly obtuned, meaning that they have a lack of oxygen due to the tetanic contraction. They have some oxygen, there will be a fetal heartbeat, but they are generally limp. Does that answer your question?
Q. And when you begin the evacuation, is the fetus ever alive?
A. Yes.
Q. How do you know that?
A. Because I do many of my procedures especially at 16 weeks under an ultrasound guidance, so I will see a heartbeat.
Q. Do you pay attention to that while you are doing the abortion?
A. Not particularly. I just notice sometimes.
~
Q. Okay. Does it every come out completely without the head becoming lodged?
A. Rarely it does.
~
Q. And you had said that sometimes when you apply traction to the fetus it comes out intact up to point where the calvarium lodges; is that correct?
A. Yes.
Q. In that circumstance, what do you do to complete the procedure?
A. Well, there are two things you can do. You can disarticulate at the neck, or what I prefer to do is to just reach in with my forceps and collapse the skull and bring the fetus out intact.
~
Q. You testified earlier, Dr. Paul, that the fetus can be alive when the evacuation begins; is that correct?
A. That's right.
Q. When in the course of the abortion does the fetus -- does fetal demise occur?
A. I don't know for sure. I certainly know that if I deliver intact and collapse the skull that demise occurs.
~
Excerpts from the Government's cross-examination of Dr. Paul:
Q. In performing a D&E at 20 weeks gestational age and above, in your previous capacity, was there ever a time when you saw any indication that the fetus was experiencing pain?
A. I have no idea what that means.
Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.