[Thorin]

Even secular historians accept that the Papacy is the oldest institution in the West. On what basis do you doubt it, a Jack Chick Bible tract?

[Havoc]

I agree. It is an old institution. It goes back to the last half of the first millenium. But even that was a matter of fraudulent claim. It only gained assent through fraud. That is the history. And that known and documented fraud is still to this day considered by historians as the greatest fraud ever perpetrated on mankind. And it was the Roman Church that did it. What do you expect people think of "Christians" because of that? Your witness goes before you.