Posted on 03/15/2004 7:11:49 PM PST by Land_of_Lincoln_John
Mahathir Mohammed, 73, who turned Malaysia into an economic tiger, voluntarily left office in October last year. But he is still a man of novel ideas and theories. Having relinquished all governmental and party posts, Mahathir is now residing in Putrajaya, the new Malaysian capital, spending time giving consultations, and contemplating upon the future. He rarely talks to the media and when he does, it is usually brief, but the former Malaysian prime minister generously sat for talks with the Mehr News Agency for about 100 minutes.
His interesting views on diverse subjects ranging from management and development to challenges facing the Islamic world have made this interview very readable. Following is part one of the three-part interview.
Q: What is your opinion about the policy of the United States toward the Islamic world, particularly in regard to nuclear energy and the problem of the Zionist regime in the Middle East?
A: Well, frankly, I am not happy about anything nuclear because obviously it can lead to the development of destructive weapons. We need to understand nuclear science because it has some role in medicine and in other things But we have to learn nuclear science because it is good for us in certain ways.
So, we should have a total ban on nuclear weapons worldwide, including the United States and Russia, because these are weapons that can destroy the human race and nobody should possess such a weapon. It is no good saying this is a rogue state and therefore it should not have nuclear weapons. For that “rogue” state, the rogue is the other one which tells him not to have the weapon, because he is afraid. They have the weapon, therefore I must have the weapon. So nobody should have the weapon. In fact, in my view, we shouldn’t even have conventional weapons. Because, now conventional weapons are very destructive. They are building a 27-ton bomb which has the same effect as a nuclear bomb. So, that’s not conventional.
And war should be something that we should not resort to. Killing people in order to achieve national policy is wrong. In our day and age, nowadays, we should negotiate and find a solution. If anybody goes to war, the whole world must stop it through the United Nations. So, my view is that nuclear weapons should not be possessed by anyone. Of course, it may be a dream. It’s not possible.
But we have to keep on saying that you cannot tell us not to have nuclear weapons when you have nuclear weapons which threaten us. Why are there people wanting to build nuclear weapons? Because those people have nuclear weapons. Israel has nuclear weapons. Why don’t you stop Israel? India and Pakistan have got nuclear weapons. China has got nuclear weapons. So, nobody should have nuclear weapons.
When you get to Israel, I keep on telling people, let’s be truthful. The Muslims never persecuted Jews. It is the European Christians who used to kill Jews eradicatively. Every now and then they kill Jews in Europe. They had the Spanish Inquisition. They had the Holocaust. Who did all this? Not Muslims. It was European Christians.
And when the European Christians kill the Jews, where do the Jews go to? Before there was America, they always went to Muslim countries. They went to Algeria, they went to Morocco, where they lived with Muslims and nothing happened. In fact, at the time of Spanish Al-Andulus, the Jews worked very well with the Muslims. They even spoke Arabic, they had Arabic names. I met a Jew, his name was Hasan. I thought he was a Muslim, but he turned out to be a Jew. So, Muslims are not anti-Jewish. It is the Europeans who are anti-Jewish. And yet, today, the Jews and the Muslims are fighting a terrible war. Why? Because the Europeans created the state of Israel. Before that, there was no fight between Muslims and Jews. Only when they started creating the state of Israel, there is a fight. And it is not religious. It is not a religious fight. It is a territorial fight. The Jews took away Muslim land…
Formerly, in Ottoman Turkey, there were a lot of Jews. They did not want to live with European Christians, they wanted to live with Muslims, because there they were free. But when they took away Muslim land in Palestine and expelled the Muslims, took away their houses, took away their farms, of course they want to come back. And they want to fight. They want to fight because that is the only way they can get back the land.
They asked the United Nations to help. Nobody helped. They tried to get Egypt, Syria, Jordan to fight a conventional war. They lost because the Europeans helped the Jews. So, what are they to do? Now nobody wants to help the Palestinians. So Palestinians can only do one thing. They resort to all kinds of terror attacks. And now, of course, other Muslims also indulge in terror attacks. It’s not a Muslim way of solving problems. But if you don’t want to negotiate, then that is the only answer.
So, I have told the European leaders, I told the Americans, you solve the Palestinian problem, you will have no more, I won’t say completely no more terrorism, but you will reduce terrorism. It is this problem. Fifty years ago Israel was created and since then there has been no peace. That’s a fact of history. Before that we did not quarrel with the Jews. Yes, we don’t like them, but we don’t say because one thousand years ago you did this, now I want to kill you. We don’t say that. But the European Christians keep on telling the Jews that Judas betrayed Christ and therefore you must be punished. Two thousand years later they are still punishing the Jews. But now they want to solve their Jewish problem by creating the state of Israel. So, they will not allow Israel to collapse, because they wanted it. As much as the Jews wanted Israel, the Europeans wanted Israel. You see, they created this problem, so they should solve it.
Q: What is your opinion about the free flow of information and the problem of the superpowers’ cultural onslaught against the Islamic world?
A: The free flow of information is good. Because, of course, it helps you to make wise decisions because you know what are the factors that affect whatever decision you make. But, that has been abused. Today the free flow of information involves also dissemination of pornography, of pictures of violence and sex and all that. And our culture is being undermined.
They say you mustn’t censor. Why? Because, again this benefit is coming from them. It is not coming from us. If we don’t censor, then, of course, our people are being corrupted. In Malaysia we have crimes now, which before we never had. Because people are watching these filthy movies and all that and they become violent because all the movies are about violence. And they have their culture, you know their culture is different from our culture.
We are very liberal in Malaysia, but we don’t want to be as liberal as the West. Of course, in some countries they are very orthodox. Those countries, I think, would not want to have their cultures undermined by the West.
But today the flow is only in one direction, from the West, from the rich countries. All the information, the filthy information, is coming from the rich countries to the poor countries. Unfortunately, of course, even in Malaysia now they have learned to produce all these filthy things. They download from the Internet. They buy the discs, they duplicate the discs. So, the culture of the world is undergoing very serious crisis. And I think, as Muslims, we would like to censor. We would like to, at least, filter out the dirt and just let the good information come through. Technologically, we still don’t have the capability. But, I believe that we can find some technology to filter out this filth coming out from the rich countries.
Q: But actually this is a kind of defensive approach. Let’s take another tack. For example, the Muslim world could create and develop some kind of cultural products and export them to other places, especially to Western countries. Do you think that the globalization process provides some opportunities for us to return to the common roots of human beings and to develop and provide cultural products that could be attractive and enjoyable for people around the world?
A: We can. The means are there. We have the means. But we must know how to use the means. If you go and tell people who are very free and they have no religion and all that, and suddenly tell them no, this is wrong, you should become good by adopting this religion, maybe becoming Muslim, you will be rejected. Now we tell people the best means of dawa [inviting people to Islam], actually, is to succeed. When we succeed, people will want to follow us. During the great Islamic civilization, people converted to Islam because Islam was a successful religion. The Christians in Spain and the Jews in Spain converted to Islam during the time of Abdurrahman and his heirs, because it was a great civilization. They could see it with their eyes. But you go and tell them, you become good and therefore in the akhara [afterlife] you will get this. For them, they don’t understand. They think that if you are good here, you get reward here, not in the afterlife. They cannot understand that.
So, how do you tell them? You have to tell them by making use of what they like, not what they don’t like, and slowly show them. The first thing, of course, we have to be successful. We have to show that by practicing our religion, we are successful. And we can be successful if we really practice the religion according to the original teachings of Islam. You know, today we have over one thousand different Muslims, you know Sunni, Shia, and then this tariqat, and then this imam. All of them are different. And we are followers of this religion, this religion, this religion. But Mohammad (S) came only with one religion, not so many. So let’s go back to the fundamentals.
Q: How can we develop our wisdom in the Muslim world?
A: You see, what is happening at the moment is that we are acting emotionally. Because you kill my people, I will kill your people. So, where does it end? That’s why I say please stop and think. It’s not getting us anywhere, it’s not improving our situation, it’s not solving any problem. We have to think. And we can think. There are many ways to solve these problems if we sit down and think about it. I can think of many ways, but I don’t want to lecture the people about it. But, use your brain. Don’t just, because you kill my people, I’m going to kill you tomorrow, and then he will kill your people, and then you kill them again. It doesn’t end anywhere. That is why I say think, please think.
You see, the Jews have been expelled from their country for two thousand years. They have been killed. They have been massacred. But they think about how to fight their battle. They don’t just, because Hitler killed six million Jews, they don’t go around killing six million Germans. Or the Spanish Inquisition, so many Jews were killed, but they didn’t reply in that way. They worked in some other way.
They are very skillful in making money. They use their money to influence.
You see any government in Europe, very close by there will be a Jewish institution which supports their government with money. Because that’s the way they fight their battle. Their wealth, it doesn’t give one hundred percent success, but it helps. All over the European world and America, who holds the money? That is people who are using brains to fight. There are six million Jews in America. They have more power than two hundred and sixty million non-Jews. We have 10 million Muslims in North America. They have one thousand organizations. They are fighting each other.
Q: How do you view the fact that the West has been fairly silent about your decision to voluntarily retire from the government, although in Asia everybody cheered your action?
A: Well, we believe in free speech. This is what the West proposes. So, we feel free to criticize them. Other countries don’t criticize the West. If they don’t like, they just don’t say anything. But if the West does something that is unjust, we feel we have a right to criticize them, and because of that we are not very much liked. But that doesn’t matter. Even if we are not liked, we have to say what we have to say. That is why, of course, they would like to see a government in Malaysia which is always saying they are right and they are good. But, you do that and they will continue to do the wrong things. You have to tell them that this is wrong.
We told them that it’s wrong to invade Afghanistan, it’s wrong to invade Iraq. Eventually people come around to think. If you don’t say it, then, I’d say, well, if you support, then say well, of course, you are very nice to them, but it doesn’t achieve anything. We believe in speaking our minds. That’s why they are very happy, of course, that I have stepped down. Then, they won’t here me saying things like that any more. But, I believe in speaking the truth.
I challenge them to say what I say is untrue. If it is untrue you say well, it is untrue. You have said that it is wrong that you should do all these things. Later on it is proved that it is wrong. I talk about their history. I say you take away people’s land. You kill people to take away their land. America is America today because Red Indians were killed, were massacred. It was their land. And now you talk about America? Whose land is it?
We have never taken other people’s land. It is the Europeans who took other people’s land. I don’t even talk about the West now. Because, again, you want to be polite. You want to say the West. We say white men. But Iranians are also white. Caucasians, Central Asians are also white. We are not talking about white men. We are talking about Europeans. People who live in Europe, they have this greed to take away other people’s land. They take Australia and kill all the people. They take America, kill all the people. They take South America, they kill all the people. They have to be told, reminded. They come and tell us, you don’t practice human rights. I say who’s talking? Did you practice human rights before? Where do you come from? Australia? How did you get to Australia? By killing the Aborigines. That’s how it becomes Australia. And you are talking about human rights? Did you practice human rights? So, they have to be reminded, don’t go around preaching to people because you are worse than us. (To be contd.)
Im even more surprised that America chooses to ignore this man's rants.
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