The Nation-State Is Finished

thenewamerican.com ^ | February 23, 2004 | William F. Jasper

[KC_for_Freedom]

Illegal immigration isn't honest policy disagreement. It's literally the collapse of civilization. And Bush is on the wrong side, and he deceived us. That's not honorable or compassionate in my eyes. That's a political sell-out, and there's no recovery.

I will repeat what you posted, it is a valid position. But Bush was still a better candidate on this issue than Gore. Bush made no claims to support conservative positions on immigration. His experience in Texas seems to have convinced him that he can increase the number of hispanic votes in his election with this approach. I happen to see things the way you do. But polls have shown this issue to be below the average voters horizon.

When I joined Bush's supporters, it was with a clear understanding that he was and is wrong on this issue. When you illegally enter the USA, you step in front of the line of everyone who is waiting legally for their chance. That is simply being a bully and we all know what to do with a bully. They are illegal, they should face deportation, no welfare, no handouts. My support for Bush is in other areas, like the war on terror where if we don't win, immigration won't matter. (Immigration of course is part of the way terrorists will enter this country.)

I do not agree that Bush was not totally clear that he was in the Jack Kemp camp on immigration, that is that in a few generations, these immigrants' kids will be voting republican. I don't buy the approach, but if I knew it, it must not have been too hard to find.

[tpaine]

"Give me a break" -Joe-




Point taken, but they keep coming. It they were told that with a vote they could come here without border hastles what would they do? And don't forget all those people who have never tried to rush the border would believe they would be qualified for welfare where they are. It would be a lot like the reunification of Germany. Lots of problems, lots of costs but they did it.
That said, I am certain the problems associated with statehood for the nation of Mexico would not be minimal.

______________________________________


Interesting article on statehood for Mexican states:


Address:http://members.aol.com/XPUS/Mexico.html

[Tailgunner Joe]

I'm sure all the "Latino-Americans" in Aztlan will be all for "reunification" with Mexico.

Maybe we can look forward to having a government as socialist as Germany's too.

[Tailgunner Joe]

Wasn't U.S. "expansion" into Mexico the dream of the Knights of the Golden Circle?

They were Democrats, weren't they?

[raybbr]

It would be a lot like the reunification of Germany.

Not even close! Different language; different culture, different monetary system, different government.

[Liz]

" Neocons to the Rescue! "

The usual neocon agitprop. They are as transparent as a pane of window glass. The depths of their insularity is such that they really think they fool the cognescenti, the stalwart American intellegentsia. Bartley's position was obviously co-opted---probably knew he had to spew the neocon line.... or else.

[tpaine]

Trying to find a tar baby are you?

Did you read the link? What is your real reason for a knee jerk reaction to being against more States in the Union?
-- Would you object to Canadian States joining us?

[Tailgunner Joe]

Not to mention different interests.

Doesn't anyone remember that Mexico sided against with France and Russia against us in Iraq? They are a full fledged member-state of the Axis of Weasels. They are going to do whatever they can to restrict US power and force us to subordinate ourselves to the UN. They hate us! Why is that so hard for some to understand?

The Pentagon has even identified them as a possible "future threat" to our national security!

"(The DIA) report says a "camp" of unaligned countries would continue to try to limit U.S. power. This group included Russia, China, France, India, Mexico, Iran and Iraq."

[tpaine]

, Tailgunner Joe wrote:
"(The DIA) report says a "camp" of unaligned countries would continue to try to limit U.S. power. This group included Russia, China, France, India, Mexico, Iran and Iraq."

______________________________________


All the more reason to include Mexico in our Union of republican states..

[Tailgunner Joe]

You are the one who wants to talk about some fantastic scheme for Mexican statehood rather than the destruction of our sovereignty by the FTAA and OAS. If you want more states in the Union why don't you start with Puerto Rico?

Oh yeah, because THEY DON'T WANT TO BE A STATE!

Guess what? NEITHER DOES MEXICO!

They want to leech of our system without having to contribute to it. It won't hurt their "pride" either because us yanquis stole all this land from them to begin with! It's only just that the ill-gotten gains of the racist American empire be redistributed to their rightful owners: THE BRONZE NATION OF AZTLAN!

[Tailgunner Joe]

Maybe we should have "reunification" with England too.

We won't need our congress at all once we are represented in Parliament!

[KC_for_Freedom]

Very interesting article, tom, I knew someone had to have though of this before me. LOL

[KC_for_Freedom]

You missed my point, I meant in terms of cost to the mother country, you identified the source of many of those costs. When they reunified Germany, they had to endure the cost of a broken and corrupt political system and the poverty it created. I simply meant that Mexico would come with a heavy price.

[KC_for_Freedom]

I'm sure all the "Latino-Americans" in Aztlan will be all for "reunification" with Mexico. Maybe we can look forward to having a government as socialist as Germany's too.

Joe, it was a suggestion to take the offense and trump the border crossers and global cabal that is threatening the USA's sovereignty. It was not meant to be jumped into with the resulting destruction of America. No new state comes into being without evaluation and assurance that the move is a good one for the USA.

The very highly pro-Mexico latins would be crushed by impending statehood, their dream of an sovereign indepent Aztlan run by socialism would be utterly destroyed. For this reason, they will be totally against it. But at no time do I forsee the government of the USA accepting socalism, as much as it seems hell bent down that path.

[Tailgunner Joe]

Something tells me "Aztlan" will just keep getting bigger and bigger along with the increase in the U.S. hispanic population. They are "America's Palestinians"

They don't want some of our land. They want it all!

Once whites become a minority, the hispanics and blacks will install a "non-white" Democrat into the Oval Office and the "reparations" will begin!

[Jackie222]

Good article! So, who do we vote for in 04? T

[B4Ranch]

If the topic of National ID CArd was ever to come up again, which it will when our state systems are too cluttered with stolen identifications to determine who you are, the one and only way I could vote for it would be if all, that means every last one, illegal alien in this country was either put on a bus or a ship and removed as soon as they were discovered.

Removing these foreigners who have come here, primarily to attain a better lifestyle while leaching on the taxpayers tit, would bring the instant awareness that 90% of the programs and agencies are not needed.

This would also bring about a unification of Americanism. Color wouldn't enter into the picture, nor would race. You would know that the person standing next to you was either a natural born or officially accepted, sworn in American.

Percentage wise first generation immigrants are a drain on America. Their children are the ones who become the producers, the kids with fresh ideas who want to make their country the best in the world.

The current group of 15 to 30 million illegals are not a positive benefit for us. They are generally uneducated, diseased, non English speaking people who are taking the 'learning' jobs away from our younger population.

Their allegence is not with America. You and I when we are driving or walking are constantly looking, without realizing it, about the safety and security of our community.

When we see someone who is drunk and walking along the road, we automatically think of the consequences to an American family should this man fall into their driving path. That's why we call the police to have this danger removed. An illegal alien doesn't have these concerns.

The cost of everything overall, including food would drop. One illegal Mexican man will cost us $5000 per year. Imagine what the costs are of one childbearing woman including the costs of her childrens education.

Immigration into America is a necessary cost that we must pay in order to gain the fresh ideas, but it must be regulated and controlled.

Last year the cost to Nevada was approximately $450 million, I don't know what California's costs were but I'm sure they were in the billions.

As a country America is in trouble, we all know that. Blindly following the Republicans will not cure our difficulty unless the leaders realize it too.

[B4Ranch]

Jackie, I'm your friend not your husband. LOL Ask him for that advice. Are you trying start a war between us? (grin)

[KC_for_Freedom]

As a country America is in trouble, we all know that. Blindly following the Republicans will not cure our difficulty unless the leaders realize it too.

I am with you, except that actually deporting 10 millions of people would not happen in a week or two. I too support the national ID as a means to determine friend or foe and to keep the foes identified once they are located.

You are also right that both parties believe that the present system has something in it for them and that the country will not suffer beyond recovery if they let a few million more in. Why is this so low on the list of concerns? Living in a Mexican neighborhood in California I saw what was happening, how they saved the teachers' jobs by bringing population to the schools because we were not having enough children. How the very same school salvation turned out to destroy the concept of education in California. "Do not give my hijo (child) homework, at home he works for me. "Teach him on school time, give him a free lunch, free medical, and a free bus ride." And we let this happen because to stand against it meant to be called a racist and be guilty of "discrimination". Jack Kemp said we will never again win California because we passed prop 187. Well politically we have lost California since then, But, is California headed in a direction we believe in?

Well, we need to become discriminatory again. And soon.

[Travis McGee]

Got rope?