Cleland's Time At The Front

Various | Hon

[Hon]

Sen. Joseph Maxwell Cleland

Sen. Max Cleland, U.S. senator from Georgia, served in the Army from 1965 to 1968 and as a Signal Corps officer from Oct. 18, 1967 to Dec. 23, 1968 in Vietnam, where he was severely wounded in a grenade explosion. Sen. Cleland was an aide to then-BG Tom Rienzi at Fort Monmouth, N.J., when he volunteered for duty with 1^st Air Cavalry Division in Vietnam. First assigned to 1^st Cavalry’s Signal battalion, CPT Cleland then volunteered as communications officer for 2d Battalion, 12^th Cavalry, which had been chosen for Operation Pegasus – the relief of Khe Sanh – in April 1968. CPT Cleland was on a mountaintop with his Signal team to set up a radio relay when he lost his legs and right arm to a grenade explosion. For Khe Sanh he received the Bronze Star for meritorious service and Silver Star for gallantry in action.

http://www.gordon.army.mil/ocos/rdiv/REGTNCO/cleland.asp

From Khe San Chronology 1962-1972:

Apr 1 [1968] - Operation PEGASUS begins; 2/1 and 2/3 (1st Marines) attack west from Ca Lu along Route 9. Elements of 3d Bde, 1st ACD conduct helo assaults into LZ Mike and Cates. Joint engineer task force begins repair of Route 9 from Ca Lu to Khe Sanh.

Apr 3 - 2d Bde, 1st ACD assaults LZs Tom and Wharton.

Apr 4 - 1/5 CavSqd moves northwest from LZ Wharton and attacks enemy units near old French fort; 1st Battalion, 9th Marines moves southeast from rock quarry and assaults Hill 471.

Apr 5 - 1/9 repulses enemy counterattack on Hill 471 and kills 122 North Vietnamese. 1st Bde, 1st ACD departs Ca Lu and assaults LZ Snapper.

Apr 6 - One company of 3d ARVN Airborne Task Force airlifted to KSCB for the initial link up with defenders. Elements of 2d Bde, 1st ACD relieve 1st Battalion, 9th Marines on Hill 471; 1/9 commences sweep to northwest toward Hill 689.

1st Bde, 1st ACD helilifted north of KSCB. 2/26 and 3/26 push north of combat base; Company G, 2/26 engages enemy force and kills 48 NVA.

Apr 8 - 2/7 CavSqd links up with 26th Marines and conducts official relief of combat base. 1/26 attacks to the west. 3d ARVN Airborne Task Force air assaults into LZ Snake west of Khe Sanh and kills 78 North Vietnamese.

http://www.geocities.com/Pentagon/4867/timeline.html

From Doxagora (a post that is meant to be very laudatory of Cleland):

While an aide [to a general] at Forth Monmouth, NJ, Cleland volunteered for a combat tour with the 1st Air Cavalry Division. Once in-theatre, then-Captain Cleland volunteered for a post as communications officer with 2d Battalion, 12th Cavalry in April, 1968. This is meaningful because Cleland knowingly volunteered for Operation PEGASUS.

Some context: At 5:30 AM on January 21st, an NVA artillery barrage hammered away at the forward base of Khe Sanh in what would prove to be a grim foreshadowing of the Tet Offensive, nine days away. By February, enemy fire made it impossible to supply Khe Sanh by C-130, and the military was forced to use paradrops and helicopters in concert with sustained attacks against NVA anti-air emplacements. Outside Khe Sanh, 20,000 NVA soldiers prepared for assault, testing Marine lines with hundreds of men at a time.

Operation PEGASUS was an air assault operation designed to break the back of the NVA at Khe Sanh. 2d Battalion, 12th Cavalry was one of the first two forces into the area, landing on April 1st at LZ WHARTON, just south of a ruined French fort (used by the NVA as the main stronghold for their attacks on the Marines) and the road leading north to Khe Sanh. 2/12 Cav and 1/5 Cav secured WHARTON, which would serve as the staging area for the assault on the fort.

On April 4, two days before the 2/5 Cav attacked the fort from LZ WHARTON, Cleland won his Silver Star. Cleland was at the battalion command post at WHARTON when NVA forces began a rocket and mortar barrage in an attempt to dislodge the Americans from their position. According to Cleland's Silver Star Order:

Capt. Cleland, disregarding his own safety, exposed himself to the rocket barrage as he left his covered position to administer first aid to his wounded comrades. He then assisted in moving the injured personnel to covered positions. Continuing to expose himself, Capt. Cleland organized his men into a work party to repair the battalion communications equipment which had been damaged by enemy fire. His gallant action is in keeping with the highest traditions of the military service, and reflects great credit upon himself, his unit, and the United States Army.

Three days later, the Old French Fort fell. On April 8, American forces set up within the defenses of Khe Sanh. 2/7 Cav moved from LZ THOR (east of WHARTON) and cleared a road to Khe Sanh, allowing American forces to link up with the Marines in the base.

Cleland was ordered to set up a radio relay on a nearby mountain. He and his signals team were airlifted to the site. While disembarking from the helicopter, Cleland saw a grenade that he thought had fallen from his webbing. Cleland tells what happened:

On April 8, 1968, I volunteered for one last mission. The helicopter moved in low. The troops jumped out with M16 rifles in hand as we crouched low to the ground to avoid the helicopter blades. Then I saw the grenade. It was where the chopper had lifted off. It must be mine, I thought. Grenades had fallen off my web gear before. Shifting the M16 to my left hand and holding it behind me, I bent down to pick up the grenade.

A blinding explosion threw me backwards.

The grenade turned out to belong to an inexperienced soldier who had incorrectly set the pin for a hair-trigger detonation.

Seven days later, Operation PEGASUS was ended as the NVA was forced out of the area. From the beginning of the siege to the end of PEGASUS, 730 Americans were killed in action, 2,642 were wounded, and 7 were officially classified as missing in action. A few months later, Khe Sanh was officially abandoned.

Although Cleland's injury occurred in a combat zone, during general combat operations, Cleland was not eligible for a Purple Heart, as his injury did not occur while in direct combat with the enemy. ("Friendly fire" injuries qualify for the Purple Heart only if the fire was directed at an enemy.)

http://www.doxagora.com/

[cyncooper]

Listen, I watched Max Cleland on Hardball at the height of the drummed up National Guard issue.

He claimed that GWB should be able to produce a certain type of form--that all who served in any of the services would have that type of form. He said this with much innuendo and cocking of eyebrow to indicate surely something was amiss here. That the president might just be a liar.

Now, either Cleland went on a nationally aired show to say something he had no knowledge of, or HE intentionally lied. Both would be in order to further the lie that GWB had not served honorably in the Air National Guard.

As it turns out, Guardsmen do NOT receive the type of form Cleland claimed "all" service people do. They receive a different type of form that the press has had a copy of for years and years and years and years,as pertains to GWB.

I will not stand by while you lie that Cleland isn't out to denigrate GWB. He damn well is.

Nobody is denigrating Cleland, my fine man. We are pointing out plain and simple FACTS, as he and others try to misportray the course of history.

So you may take your umbrage and stuff it.

[cyncooper]

You have to understand that there are 'conservatives' on FR who, if the Democrats nominated Jesus, would immediately begin to nudge each other and crack jokes about Mary Magdelene.

What rot.

Not a great thinker there, are you? Best to hold off on hitting "post" and embarrassing yourself so.

[cyncooper]

I spit on you and all others that want to belittle the service others have given to our country.

Then I take it you are spitting on Cleland for his belittling of George W. Bush's service?

[johnb838]

IF Kerry cheated to get out and then comes back here and falsely accuses his fellow servicemen of atrocities while committing treason himself, then that matters a damn sight more than the fact that he served. Your position is simple-minded. Stop buying into their propaganda.

[cyncooper]

Why don't you spell out how you think Cleland is "being trashed".

Hm?

[devane617]

cyncooper, I tried to think of a good reason/benefit to even bring up this stuff. What is the benefit to the conservative effort etc. I could think of none. Therefore I feel the post serves no other purpose other than he is a very liberal Dem that is an easy target.

[jwalsh07]

Clelands servie record is a nn issue in all regards except that we should be thankful for the men and women who serve this country.

His lying about other peoples records is an issue and he should be called a liar when he lies.

[Hon]

"I tried to think of a good reason/benefit to even bring up this stuff."

Well, it is true.

Have you read any of the things Cleland has said or is currently saying?

[Krodg]

I don't know if you noticed the threads I posted about Bush's AWOL.

How could anyone fail to notice the threads you've started? You remind us constantly!

I don't mean to be immodest, but you are...

In the short time you've been here, you're supposedly 'great' research has earned you many friends. However, your arrogant, condescending attitude is earning you another reputation.

Your big scoops are a 'phone call' that can't be proven, an excerpt from a newsgroup that is public domain, and a pic that you didn't have permission to use.

I don't have a problem with you being FReeper of the Year, but it would be nice if you could learn to be gracious.

[Howlin]

I spit on you and all others that want to belittle the service others have given to our country. You are a snake and your venom can only hurt those you are trying to help

You need to get control of yourself or get off this site.

There is absolutely NO CALL for talk like that here on FR.

[devane617]

Now this is funny and so true.

[Hon]

It's always counter-productive to respond to trolls, but what the heck.

"Your big scoops are a 'phone call' that can't be proven"

Except it can be proven. You can call Turnipseed and ask him. Also, the material I posted from my conversation with Turnipseed has been since re-posted in articles accounting other interviews with the Brigadier General. But don't let such minor details get in the way of a good rant.

"an excerpt from a newsgroup that is public domain, and a pic that you didn't have permission to use."

I didn't claim my "Meet The Press" thread to be a scoop. Obviously NBC knew about it. As for you comments about getting permission to use the photo, I had been in touch with the Corbis reps as the mods here can attest to. So far, you aren't doing very well.

"I don't have a problem with you being FReeper of the Year, but it would be nice if you could learn to be gracious."

It sounds like you have a big problem with me getting praise for my work. You post here and your others posts to me reek of the green eyed monster.

And once again you have gotten your basic facts wrong. It has been suggested by others that I should be made "Rookie Of The Year," not "Freeper Of the Year."

If it is any consolation, I doubt that I will ever be nominated for either distinction. But if nominated I will not serve.

Do you feel better now?

[Stone Mountain]

Of course this is not to denigrate Cleland's service in any way shape or form.

Sure it is. And I think it's a bad idea. We complain when liberals denigrate war service. Bringing up inconsequential issues like these makes us no better than them.

[Stone Mountain]

Instead of giving me a bunch of links that do not clearly say how my headline is misleading, maybe you could just spell it out in plain English.

Sure, first would you please identify the where the "front", FLOT or FEBA was located for combat operations in Vietnam during the year Cleland was in Vietnam.

Second, would you provide a chronology of actions that occurred in Vietnam during that year that the 1st Cav, and specifically Cleland, did not participate.

Third, could you explain which of the eight days between 1-8 April, 1968, Cleland was "at the front" and which ones he was not.

Good questions. I hope you get some answers. I'm not holding my breath though...

[Stone Mountain]

I do disagree with Cleland's political ideas in his post-Vietnam political jobs. You can disagree with those without putting down the Vet's service record. Same deal with Kerry and McCaine.

Bingo. It is repulsive and unseemly to see Freepers denigrating people who put their lives on the line for our country because they happen to hold a view that we don't agree with.

[Stone Mountain]

I apologize to all who feel offended by this. All I can say is that the information is true. I don't see why people should be offended by the truth.

Give me a break. It's obvious from the original title of your article and the information therein that you are attempting to minimize Cleland's sacrifice for our country. For you to deny that is liberal parsing of the worst sort. At least admit what you are doing instead of playing innocent. "I don't see why people should be offended by the truth." Really? You have tried to understand what people could possibly be offended by when you post this and you have no clue at all? Even after reading posts by people far more articulate than me who have explained it to you? Do you understand now or are you still claiming ignorance here?

[Hon]

It sure is entertaining to be attacked by a bunch of rabid dogs for posting the truth.

Here is some more truth for you:

there is this from the boston globe:

“After the explosion, the Army gave Cleland the Soldier's Medal, for shielding his men from the grenade blast (no one was nearby, he says), and the Silver Star, for coming to the aid of wounded troops the night of the Khe Sanh rocket attack (something he says his men did, but he did not do).”

and THIS from larry king live:

"CLELAND: This is a Silver Star, but I really got that for what my men did on a hill the night before. We went into Khe Sanh."

Go chase yourself.

[Stone Mountain]

It sure is entertaining to be attacked by a bunch of rabid dogs for posting the truth

Ooh, I'm a rabid dog. But no reponse to the actual points I made. I see.

[Hon]

When you make a coherent point I will happily respond to it.

I don't do trolls.

[Stone Mountain]

When you make a coherent point I will happily respond to it. I don't do trolls.

Gee, first she calls me a rabid attack dog, now I'm a troll.

Here's one point. You claim, "I don't see why people should be offended by the truth." Do you stand by your statement that you don't understand why anyone is offended here?

Here's another. Are you saying that when you posted this, the idea that you were minimizing Cleland's sacrifice to our country honestly didn't occur to you at all? Even with your original title?