Free Republic
Browse · Search
News/Activism
Topics · Post Article

To: Alberta's Child; Willie Green; Wolfie; ex-snook; Jhoffa_; FITZ; arete; FreedomPoster; Red Jones; ...
There is no such thing as a "stable job" -- so get used to the chaos we're seeing today.

People cannot live in chaos for long. Cultures, states, communites, families and children cannot prosper in chaos. Even slaves will not tolerate chaos for long. And your money and cherished "property" would be devoured by chaos.

But before your chaos takes over, the order will be restored in other way.

Rome established a republic in 509 B.C. The Senators who ruled the city were elected by popular vote, but Roman law restricted what they could do. As a result, the people were free, and most of them prospered. With the passage of time, however, a ruling class evolved and began using the Senate to pursue their expansionist agenda. A series of foreign wars ensued which enriched the oligarchy and impoverished the people. Those who acquired wealth purchased vast tracts of land and farmed them with slaves captured in battle. Small farmers couldn't compete with them, and they were forced to sell their land. Class warfare broke out, and the power of the State was expanded to control the populace. The right to vote was extended to promote democracy and quiet dissent. The oligarchy began fighting among themselves for positions of power, which led to ever increasing chaos. Eventually Augustus Caesar intervened and replaced the Roman Republic with the Roman Empire.
(Encyclopedia Americana Volume 23, pp. 665-69.)

99 posted on 02/18/2004 8:48:03 AM PST by A. Pole (The genocide of Albanians was stopped in its tracks before it began.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 84 | View Replies ]


To: A. Pole
People cannot live in chaos for long. Cultures, states, communites, families and children cannot prosper in chaos. Even slaves will not tolerate chaos for long. And your money and cherished "property" would be devoured by chaos.

Bumps to that. If people are looking at their future as a programmer or a doctor and seeing jobs flying to India or hospitals bringing in foreign doctors as nurses (and eventually doctors) they're going to wonder what's in it for them? The argument of "oh you'll just get the better job as for some reason Americans are smarter than everyone else" isn't flying.

Or put it this way: one man, one vote is a cruel master.
106 posted on 02/18/2004 9:03:37 AM PST by lelio
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 99 | View Replies ]

To: A. Pole
A lot of similarities of what has been/is going on here in the US.
111 posted on 02/18/2004 9:25:19 AM PST by looscnnn (Tell me something, it's still "We the people", right? -- Megadeth (Peace Sells))
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 99 | View Replies ]

To: A. Pole
Interesting analogy.

The Roman Model is a little different than ours. The farmers who were impoverished were actually the soldiers who fought the war and captured the slaves. While they were out capaigning, they couldn't pay their land taxes, and the state often confiscated their farms. The rich oligarchs bought the farms up and transformed them into latifundia or plantations, which were then staffed by the slaves captured by the free farmers who were purchased from the state by the oligarchs. Sort of adding insult to injury.

Eventually the oligarchs separated into two classes, the Optimates or aristocratic conservatives and the Populares or aristocrats who were reformers and recognized the inequities created by the system and tried to ram reforms through an antiquated and corrupt structure.

The Roman citizen-soldier-farmer became increasingly disillusioned with the indifference of the Senate, particularly the Optimates towards their dilemma and began to look to their generals rather than the state to rectify these social issues. And so it began.

A series of military dictators and bloody civil wars ensued with eventual power being seized by demagogues of the Populares faction like Julius Caesar, and later Octavian, who in effect dissolved the REAL functions of the Senate while retaining the outward trappings and form of the Republican offials and government and ruled through the unabashed application of military power.

When Augustus freed the exhausted Roman citizenry from the obligation of military service and began replacing them with non-Roman soldiers, the yoke of tyranny became even tighter and led to the later collapse of the entire system. The military became the de facto government and in effect, made and removed Emperors. Eventually more civil wars between contending Emperor candidates and their largely foreign military forces put an end to the Empire.

I think the lessons we can draw from this is that the Democrats of today seek to address what are, in many cases, justifiable social problems, but attempt to use the wrong methods to solve them. Like the Demagogues of Ancient Rome, they are not interested in tradition, the Constitution, or the basic founding principles of the state. At the same time, we have switched to a largely professional military force instead of a citizen army of draftees, and a growing number of those soldiers are actually not even American Citizens. None of this is very good, and shadows to some degree what happened in Ancient Rome.

There are other omnious analogies also, such as the breakdown in public morality, the loss of a sense of patriotism and loyalty to the nation, etc., etc.

149 posted on 02/18/2004 10:40:06 AM PST by ZULU (GOD BLESS SENATOR McCARTHY!!!!)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 99 | View Replies ]

To: A. Pole
People cannot live in chaos for long. Cultures, states, communites, families and children cannot prosper in chaos. Even slaves will not tolerate chaos for long. And your money and cherished "property" would be devoured by chaos.

This is profoundly true. Almost all people need stability, it's the nature of man. Historically, the usual result of chaos is some form of totalarisansm to reestablish stability. Our global ruling class (both seen and unseen) are not ignorant of this. Our founding fathers weren't either.

156 posted on 02/18/2004 11:17:32 AM PST by templar
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 99 | View Replies ]

To: A. Pole
You live in a chaotic universe, get used to it.

The Second Law of Thermodynamics: Learn it, live it, love it.

164 posted on 02/18/2004 12:26:09 PM PST by Redcloak (This tagline is for external use only. Discontinue if a rash develops. Induce vomiting if swallowed.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 99 | View Replies ]

Free Republic
Browse · Search
News/Activism
Topics · Post Article


FreeRepublic, LLC, PO BOX 9771, FRESNO, CA 93794
FreeRepublic.com is powered by software copyright 2000-2008 John Robinson