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To: jwh_Denver; Mr. Silverback
God clearly puts the blame on the then living Jews... WRONG Go back and read where the answer to the question in this thread is given.

Acts 4:24 And when they heard that, they lifted up their voice to God with one accord, and said, Lord, thou [art] God, which hast made heaven, and earth, and the sea, and all that in them is:

Act 4:25 Who by the mouth of thy servant David hast said, Why did the heathen rage, and the people imagine vain things?

Act 4:26 The kings of the earth stood up, and the rulers were gathered together against the Lord, and against his Christ.

Act 4:27 For of a truth against thy holy child Jesus, whom thou hast anointed, both Herod, and Pontius Pilate, with the Gentiles, and the people of Israel, were gathered together,

Act 4:28 For to do whatsoever thy hand and thy counsel determined before to be done.

197 posted on 03/16/2004 8:59:35 PM PST by Prodigal Daughter
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To: Prodigal Daughter; Terry Mross; Francisco; #3Fan
Eph 4:2 With all lowliness and meekness, with longsuffering, forbearing one another in love;
Eph 4:3 Endeavouring to keep the unity of the Spirit in the bond of peace.

My argrument is not with the Scriptures. I found posts here with some excellent Scriptures and understanding by Francisco #164,167.

Therefore, let all the House of Israel know assuredly, that God hath made that same Jesus, whom ye have crucified, both Lord and Christ. [Acts 2:36]

Be it known unto you all, even to all the people of Israel, that by the name of Jesus Christ of Nazareth, whom ye crucified, whom God raised from the dead, even by him doth this man stand before you whole. [Acts 4:10]

And when Peter saw it, he answered unto the people, 'Ye men of Israel .... Jesus, whom ye delivered up, and denied in the presence of Pilate, when he was determined to let him go. But ye denied the Holy One and the Just, and desired a murderer to be granted unto you; and killed the Prince of life, whom God hath raised from the dead; whereof we are witnesses.' [Acts 3:12-15]

And we are witnesses of all things which he did both in the land of the Jews, and in Jerusalem; whom they slew and hanged on a tree. [Acts 10:39]

Were you there? No. Then how do you know "most" of the Jews didn't know this was taking place? Where is your text to prove that "most" of the Jews didn't know this was taking place?

You didn't agree with my comparison of "slaves" to "Jews" of 2000 years ago. Modern day Jews don't have anyone coming around that's supposed to be the Messiah, either. So, for someone as simple minded as I, it's very clear who I'm talking about when I say "The Jews".

I said it's my oppinion. It is my belief. Now I'll give you the chapter and verses showing why it is my belief.

Jesus was a Jew. Jesus was speaking to "His" people. Therefore, Jesus was preaching to the Jews.

Matthew 26:(3) and I quote "Then the chief priests (plural) AND the elders of THE PEOPLE assembled in the palace of the high priest, whose name was Caiaphas, and THEY plotted to arrest Jesus in some sly way and kill him." (I can't see how anyone can read this and not see the "they" and not think it is Jesus' own people. It sure wasn't the Romans "assembled in the palace".)

Next, Matthew 26:(14) and I quote "Then one of the twelve, the one called Judas Iscariot, went to the chief priests and asked, 'What are you willing to give me if I hand him over to you?' So THEY counted out for him thirty silver coins." (Again, were these Roman priests?)

Next, concerning Judas, Matthew 26:(47) "With him was a large crowd armed with swords and clubs, SENT from the chief priests and the elders of THE PEOPLE."

Matthew 26:(59) "The chief priests and the WHOLE Sanhedrin were looking for false evidence against Jesus so that they could put him to death. But they did not find any, though many came forward." (This tells me the Sanhedrin, all Jews, were the ones falsely testifying against Him.)

Matthew 26:(66) The high priest asked "What do you think? 'He is worthy of death', THEY answered." (Now, where you get the idea that there was anyone present other than the Jewish people is beyond me.)

Matthew 27:(12) "When He was accused by the chief priests and elders He gave no answer. (13) Then Pilate asked him, 'Don't you hear how many things they are accusing you of?'" (Again, who is THEY? According to this scripture THEY are the priests and elders. No Romans or Samaritans, et al are mentioned.)

Finally Matthew 27:(15) "Now it was the governor's CUSTOM at the Feast to release a prisoner CHOSEN by the crowd." (This Feast was a Jewish holiday. I have no reason to think that those present were of anything but the Jewish faith.) (16) "At that time they had a notorious prisoner, called Barabbas."

(17) "So, when the crowd had gathered, Pilate asked them, 'Which one do you want me to release to you: Barabbas, or Jesus who is called Christ?' (18) For he knew it was out of envy that THEY had handed Jesus over to him."

(19) "While Pilate was sitting on the judge's seat, his wife sent him this message: 'Don't have anything to do with that innocent man, for I have suffered a great deal today in a dream because of him.'"

(20) "But the chief priests (plural) and the elders PERSUADED the crowd to ask for Barabbas and to have Jesus executed."

(21)"'Which of the two do you want me to release to you?' asked the governor. 'Barabbas, they answered."

(22) "What shall I do, then, with Jesus who is called Christ?' Pilate asked. They ALL answered, 'Crucify him!'"

Verse 24 Pilate says, "It is your responsibility". (Since they had ALL answered "Crucify him", I see no reason to believe the "all" who answered were of anything but the Jewish faith?)

(25) "ALL the people answered, 'Let his blood be on us and on our children.'" (This is the verse many quote as the reason for the Jews continual persecution. I don't think this is true because my God forgives and they didn't have a choice.)

So, there you have it. Not my oppinion but my belief based on scripture. The "Jews" of that day were responsible for Christ's crucifiction. For some reason the Jews of today don't want to accept that. Like I said, if I was still of the Jewish faith I would say, "Don't blame me. First of all, I wasn't there. Second, those who were there didn't have a choice."

I apologize for incorrect spellings or typos that may appear. For instance, I know Pilate is not Pilot. Then again, he didn't speak English, either so I really don't know what his name was or how it was spelled.

Therefore, let all the House of Israel know assuredly, that God hath made that same Jesus, whom ye have crucified, both Lord and Christ. [Acts 2:36]

Be it known unto you all, even to all the people of Israel, that by the name of Jesus Christ of Nazareth, whom ye crucified, whom God raised from the dead, even by him doth this man stand before you whole. [Acts 4:10]

And when Peter saw it, he answered unto the people, 'Ye men of Israel .... Jesus, whom ye delivered up, and denied in the presence of Pilate, when he was determined to let him go. But ye denied the Holy One and the Just, and desired a murderer to be granted unto you; and killed the Prince of life, whom God hath raised from the dead; whereof we are witnesses.' [Acts 3:12-15]

"And when Peter saw it, he answered unto the people, 'Ye men of Israel"

Prodigal Daughter, I will peacefully debate the Scriptures but I'm not going to engage in warfare. Period. You accept the Scriptures or you don't. I looked at the Scriture you quoted and I have some doubts about it being appropiate. Grace and peace to you from God the Father and that Lord Jesus Christ.

199 posted on 03/16/2004 10:34:32 PM PST by jwh_Denver (I think I think, therefore I am, or maybe not.)
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