Free Republic
Browse · Search
News/Activism
Topics · Post Article

To: Prof Utonium
This is just TOO easy! First, no offense, but you obviously don't read too much (or think you do) because you are clueless. Let's break them down: Habeas corpus is dead. That's major and significant.

First, Lincoln was the only President to actually stop Habeas corpus. We aren't even close. Second, you are again confusing the issue with WHOM the right is being denied. You, like liberals and Buchananites, think this loss applies to EVERYONE! Bull, that's just nonsense.

And in regard to suspected terrorists, only one so far, it's not denying anyone a hearing before a court to determine if their detention is lawful. One reason is the law was changed to SAY such detentions were lawful. And even in the case of Padilla, he GOT a court hearing. If anything, the Justice Dept has been too lenient in it's usage. Even John Lindh got off with a slap on the wrist when I would have tried him for treason.

We now need permission to travel. That's major and significant.

Wrong again. We don't need permission. You can get in your car right now and go anywhere you want and if don't speed, have a headlight out or break any other traffic laws, nothing will happen. Same for taking the bus, getting a taxi, etc. Oh, so you are talking about flying I'll assume. First, you had to have passport to go out the country already and you can still fly anywhere you want RIGHT NOW! (I bet you Libertarians even think passports are too much government control).

So what permission are you talking about? The fact you have to basically PROVE who you are when you fly? So the airline now has to make sure YOU are who YOU say YOU are! Oh horror!

And let's look at that complaint. It's because of your Libertarian ideals that we never thought actually profile young men from the Middle East on Visas paying cash for a one-way ticket! God forbid, that would require Big Brother breathing down our necks. Now you complain about the random checking of old ladies! While I'll give you the old lady part (you never know though - what if the terrorist know we won't check old ladies? Are you willing to bet they won't find some, pay them off, and use them to smuggle stuff onto a flight? Huh? Huh? Of course not), vigilance isn't control.

"Privacy" is now a dead issue. Bush proposed that the cable guy and the mailman and the gas company meter reader all were to become agents of the federal government.

Another canard and total paranoia. Is anyone, right now, knocking down your door? Tapping your phones? Watching what you type here? If so, wouldn't those same evil government agents in black suits be dragging you off for your nonconformity? You'd be in a cell right now along side Saddam getting anal examinations!

Oh, and Bush never "proposed" creating agents out of mailmen and meter readers. I'll bet good money your knees are badly bruised since they must jerk so bad. The "proposal" was to create a simple national HOTLINE to call in suspicious behavior. I could get into LONG explanations (like people just after 9/11 saw Arabian men taking pictures near airports and called the FBI only to be referred to local authorities that just referred them back to the FBI, etc.) but I won't. And Bush said people should be watchful.

Now, who best to be watchful than the guys that go to homes every single day? Or the truck drivers that are on the road? The DC area snipers (black Muslims but Chief Moose wanted to find white guys even in a white van because he's a racist) were found by a TRUCK DRIVER being alert. But you and the liberals think he meant actually deputizing these people. That's just not true. So you are saying that if a mailman walks up to your house to deliver the mail and sees in the open window some thug beating the crap out of you he should just move on and ignore it? Because that's what you are inferring. All Bush the TIP program was talking about was centralizing and helping the public report activity.

If you saw something tomorrow you thought could be terrorist trying something who would you call? Ghostbusters? And as I pointed out, you can call agency after agency and have to deal with some pinhead moron (of this we conservatives and libertarians agree - the liberals think they are geniuses) and get nothing done. Wouldn't a hotline to the Homeland Security Dept. be better?

I don't know what offends me more. The fact you and others actually believe this garbage you spout or the fact you don't even bother to learn the truth when it's right there at your fingertips with a simple Google and comprehension of the English language.

65 posted on 02/13/2004 2:33:21 AM PST by Fledermaus (Democrats are just not capable of defending our nation's security. It's that simple!)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 54 | View Replies ]


To: Fledermaus
What are you smoking ??

Lincoln was the only one to suspend Habeus Corpus -- where have you been ??

Didn't you read right here on FR yesterday that U.S. citizen Jose Padilla finally is being provided an attorney, after being locked up for more than two years, denied all of his rights.

Didn't you read, that under SAMS and the Patriot Act, the government will 'supervise/monitor' the discussion between the lawyer and his client ??

Get in your car and drive across the country ??

I know you didn't mention flying because you know all about Total Information Awareness (TIA) and CAPPS II, that level of scrutiny constitutes tacit 'permission to travel.'

Drive across the country indeed. You're progress is monitored all along the way. Every toll booth records your travel, use a credit card to buy your gas, another record available without warrant under the Patriot Act, make a cell phone call, easy to track - Patriot Act requires no warrant to obtain record. There are proposals to require GPS installed in every cell phone, every call will be encoded with your precise lat/long (all in the name of 'for your safety,' of course). Got GM EnCore - you're really hosed now.

Travel through any cities with 'Red Light Cameras' that are there to "save lives?" They can all collect your tag number and feed it into that big TIA computer, along with all the other data, the Jack Booted Thugs are never more than 10 minutes away from picking you up if they want to.

Technically you're right, you don't need a permission slip to travel, yet. But today, right now - the government has in place the technology and the resources to deny your travel anytime they choose to do so.

That is, to me, you have permission to travel unless we say no.

I could go on - but your every counterpoint is flawed and naive.

You will claim I need a tin foil hat - maybe so. But, I don't intend ever to become one of the "sheeple" for which the term was invented.

75 posted on 02/13/2004 3:32:29 AM PST by skip2myloo
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 65 | View Replies ]

Free Republic
Browse · Search
News/Activism
Topics · Post Article


FreeRepublic, LLC, PO BOX 9771, FRESNO, CA 93794
FreeRepublic.com is powered by software copyright 2000-2008 John Robinson