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To: Wolfstar
Tell me what those "conservative principles are." Then we might have something to discuss.

OK. Among fundamental conservative principles, I'd include:

1.) A desire for a smaller, less intrusive federal government which spends less money.

2.) Respect for the U.S. Constitution.

There are others, but that's a starting point.

68 posted on 02/11/2004 12:32:43 PM PST by Sloth (We cannot defeat foreign enemies of the Constitution if we yield to the domestic ones.)
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To: Sloth; Henrietta; Austin Willard Wright; My2Cents; onyx
Thanks, Sloth, for your attempt. I genuinely appreciate it. On your point #1, I agree. However, the argument over a weak vs. a strong central government was lost as early as the administration of George Washington. It's true. Then, what vestiges of the federal system envisioned by the founders still existed in 1860 were wiped away with the Civil War.

From the moment the states ratified the Constitution, there has never been a day when the federal government has ceased to grow and gain more and more power. In our time, we cannot overturn more than 225 years of history. We can only argue on the margins of debates settled long ago.

Re your point #2, respect for the Constitution isn't good enough. What's needed is a solid understanding of the Constitution, the historical context in which it was written and ratified, an understanding of just how far we have deviated from the Jeffersonian model, and an understanding of how to try to apply that early Constitutional framework to the world in which we find ourselves today.

To run around saying, "I'm a real conservative, and you're not," and "I'm the one with principles, not you," is unproductive and self-defeating. There are as many "flavors" of conservatives as there are in any ideology. They are all real, but different issues motivate different people at different times.

The one overriding hallmark of conservatism is protection of the nation. It is that very, very conservative impulse which motivates those of us who intend to vote for President Bush. If these were ordinary times, I could have more sympathy for the arguments you and others make about spending, immigration, etc. But these most definitely are NOT ordinary times. That is the fault line between those folks who share your point of view and those who share mine. It has nothing whatsoever to do with who has or doesn't have "real" conservative principles, but who has the correct vision of how best to preserve this nation.

108 posted on 02/11/2004 1:02:44 PM PST by Wolfstar (A self-confident cowboy nation, or a Kerrified nation. Your choice.)
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