Ex-atheist describes near-death experience

Standard-Times ^ | 1/31/2004 | LINDA ANDRADE RODRIGUES

[Froggie]

A friend of ours had a similar experience....when the baby was 2, the older boys (age 6) were supposed to watch her while mother went to the bathroom. She crawled out the doggie door as the boys watched cartoons. She got into the pool....mom came out of bathroom, looked for the girl -- no where to be found.....for some reason went to the pool and found her face down in the shallow end...
pulled her out - CPR - paramedics - helicoptered to hospital childrens ICU - She was in a coma for about a week - on the ventilator....one day in ICU, a African American "priest" shows up and tells the nurses he is from the cathedral in town and is here to bless the child. They let him in - the blessing is performed (mom is here at the time) and he chats with her - prays, and leaves....the next morning the baby wakes up - gets off vent in 48 hours and goes home about two weeks later.....mother asks the nurses who that priest was and they say they had never seen him before. She calls the cathedral to find him to tell him thanks and let him know his power or prayer made a huge difference to her and to the baby.....the personnel at the cathedral tell her that they have never had an African-American priest at that cathedral.....then, about a year or so later, mom takes baby shopping -- as they are entering the supermarket, a black man is wheeling his groceries out....the little girl tugs on her mothers arm and tells her mother, "mommy, there is my angel!"
Today she is a health teenager...unfortunately, like my son, without recollection of these events....but the family knows that they were blessed!

[Sabatier]

I think we should always be skeptical - as long as we include being skeptical about being skeptical:)

[moondoggie]

You just made my point!

The Bible says there most definitely is a division in the afterlife. Those who are saved live eternally in heaven, those who are lost live eternally in hell.

Christians call it "heaven"and "hell" and other religions have other names for it.

My post wasn't meant to start a religious debate only to point out that each religion has different names for the "afterlife".

Sorry if you misunderstood:-(

[Quix]

EVIDENTLY,

1. You have never actually read the Bible 2. You have read the Bible but have never understood it.

[greenwolf]

He followed them shuffling along in his bare feet with the memory of pain in his belly, yet feeling very much alive. The fog thickened as they went on, and it became gradually darker.

Overwhelmed with hopelessness, he told them he would go no farther and that they were liars. He could feel their breath on him as they shouted and snarled insults. Then they began to push and shove him about, and he began to fight back. A wild frenzy of taunting, screaming and hitting ensued. As he swung and kicked at them, they bit him.

Even though he couldn't see anything in the darkness, he was aware there were dozens or hundreds of them all around and over him and that his attempts to fight back only provoked greater merriment.

They began to tear off pieces of his flesh, and he realized that he was being taken apart and eaten alive, methodically, slowly, so that their entertainment would last as long as possible. In that wretched state he lay there in the darkness. Suddenly remembering a prayer from childhood Sunday School class, he said, "Yea though I walk in the valley of the shadow of death, I will fear no evil, for thou art with me."

To his amazement, the cruel merciless beings were incited to rage by his prayer. They screamed at him, 'There is no God! Nobody can hear you!"

If they were screaming "God is the enemy!" or "Don't follow God, follow us!" or something like that you'd figure they were sinners. The idea of shouting "There is no God!" sort of says evolutionists.

[malakhi]

my Grandfather told my uncle that his deceased aunt (my Grandfather's aunt!) had appeared to him in the cab to say, 'No need to hurry and fret, Ralph, she's with us now.'

Hmmm... he must have been suffering oxygen deprivation, too.

[stanz]

So, you are sitting in judgement.
You don't know a rat's ass about me and I would prefer that in the future, should you choose to post to me, you would stick to the issues in the thread and not make personal assessments of my character, my mood, my choices or my conduct. I will do the same.

[malakhi]

and who, by the way, wants you to not just rattle that plate next time.

Thank goodness there are no scientists who want a piece of my paycheck...

[realpatriot71]

John 3:16 "For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life.

Of course belief in Christ is the only way to eternal life. The saved will live eternally with God after the second coming, but not because of their own immortality of the soul, but because of a gift from God.

Phil 1:21-24 For to me, to live is Christ and to die is gain. If I am to go on living in the body, this will mean fruitful labor for me. Yet what shall I choose? I do not know! I am torn between the two: I desire to depart and be with Christ, which is better by far; but it is more necessary for you that I remain in the body.

Paul knew that since "the dead know nothing" that the first thing he would see, relative to his perception, after his death would be the face of his Redeemer. For to die in the Lord is akin to being with the Lord immediately after death, as the dead and saved will have no experience after death, save that of the resurrection. Furthermore, if the saved go to heaven at death, there is no need for a ressurection.

2 Cor 5:6-10 Therefore we are always confident and know that as long as we are at home in the body we are away from the Lord. We live by faith, not by sight. We are confident, I say, and would prefer to be away from the body and at home with the Lord. So we make it our goal to please him, whether we are at home in the body or away from it. For we must all appear before the judgment seat of Christ, that each one may receive what is due him for the things done while in the body, whether good or bad.

Of course the righteous want to be free from this "body" of sin and be with the Lord, and of course God will Judge all. This is a proof of life after death?

2 Thess 1:6-10 God is just: He will pay back trouble to those who trouble you and give relief to you who are troubled, and to us as well. This will happen when the Lord Jesus is revealed from heaven in blazing fire with his powerful angels. He will punish those who do not know God and do not obey the gospel of our Lord Jesus. They will be punished with everlasting destruction and shut out from the presence of the Lord and from the majesty of his power on the day he comes to be glorified in his holy people and to be marveled at among all those who have believed. This includes you, because you believed our testimony to you.

Yes, the wicked will be destroyed. This verse however does not support "the wicked currently in hell". God will judge and God will destroy and this destruction will be everlasting. That is the end result - the destruction of the wicked - is eternal, not the punishing process.

Rev 6:9-11 When he opened the fifth seal, I saw under the altar the souls of those who had been slain because of the word of God and the testimony they had maintained. They called out in a loud voice, "How long, Sovereign Lord, holy and true, until you judge the inhabitants of the earth and avenge our blood?" Then each of them was given a white robe, and they were told to wait a little longer, until the number of their fellow servants and brothers who were to be killed as they had been was completed.

Be VERY careful making any literal conclusions from such a highly symbolic book of prophecy.

John 14:1-3 "Do not let your hearts be troubled. Trust in God; trust also in Me. In my Father's house are many rooms; if it were not so, I would have told you. I am going there to prepare a place for you. And if I go and prepare a place for you, I will come back and take you to be with me that you also may be where I am.

EXACTLY! We go to heaven when Christ comes back for His people, not before.

Luke 16:22-24 "The time came when the beggar died and the angels carried him to Abraham's side. The rich man also died and was buried. In hell, where he was in torment, he looked up and saw Abraham far away, with Lazarus by his side. So he called to him, 'Father Abraham, have pity on me and send Lazarus to dip the tip of his finger in water and cool my tongue, because I am in agony in this fire.'

This is a parable - an object lessen - NOT a discussion of the afterlife and ironically enough read verse 31 of the same chapter clearly states: "An he said unto him, If they hear not Moses and the Prophets, niether will they be persuaded, though one rose from the dead. Obviously God does NOT intend to use the "dead" to convert. Now to the parable itself, if taken literally, we can assume that those in hell can talk to not only God but the saved - NOT BIBLICAL! We can also assume that Abraham has a VERY large bosom (it'll be VERY interesting to meet him if this is the case). The point of this parable is not that there are people in hell, but rather that God will not use the dead to convert. It's simple. Christ used pagan symbology familiar wth his crowd to create a story that had a real religious point. Using this parable as a proof, only hurts your argument.

The verses you quoted from the Old Testament were written in the context of a man's earthly perspective on physical death. Thus, phrases like "the dead know nothing" or "the dead do not praise the Lord" are used.

Remember your parable? What did Christ have to say about those who do not hear Moses and the prophets? Who wrote the OT? Does the Bible, the Word of the God Most High ever contradict itself? If "God is not the author of confusion" (I Cor. 14:33), then why the apparent contradiction? You have quite a cognitive dissonance to clear up I fear.

It is written: "All scripture is given by the inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness" 2 Tim. 3:16

It is written: "Study to show thyself approved unto God, a workman that needeth not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth" 2 Tim 2:15

It is written: "A fool despiseth his father's instruction: but he that regardeth reproof is prudent" Proverbs 15:5

It is written: "A man that is an heretic after the first and second admonition reject, knowing that he that is such is subverted and sinneth, being condemned of himself" Titus 3:10,11

Think on these things.

[cmak9]

I'm not interested in getting into a debate about this, but if the gates of Hell are open (they won't prevail against His church, the Bible says so), I don't think there will be many who are stupid enough to remain there (though there will probably be a few, since many are stupid enough to reject Him in this life). There are many other such verses (1 John 2;2, 1 Timothy 4:10 are some of the more obvious ones).

Like I said, I don't want to get into a debate (this has been debated ad nauseum on other websites, and is somewhat off topic for this site), but I may not be the one who is misleading people. My God is not going to burn anyone endlessly, without the chance of escape. That is not the definition of Love. If you want further info pointing you to more information, please freepmail me. If not, you believe what you want to believe, and I'll do the same.

[cmak9]

One had best insure that one is on God's side NOW.

I couldn't agree more!

[aruanan]

They are also SUBJECTIVE AND FICKLE...

Not exactly qualities you probably had in mind for your diety of choice, eh?

Your understanding of theology and, well, reality in general appears to be about as adequate as your spelling.

[Aquinasfan]

I saw this on a TV show a few years ago. It's a powerful story. But if not for the grace of God, he could have dismissed this experience as a hallucination, just as Larry Flynt dismissed his vision of angels during his brief conversion to Christianity.

Fortunately, we can know of God's existence through reason alone. From observing the beauty and complexity of nature, we can intuit a designer. "The fool in his heart says there is no God."

[Aquinasfan]

but I'll never believe differently.

I believe you.

[Aquinasfan]

There's nothing Biblical about being able to be saved once you're dead.

Yes, once you're dead, you're judged and that's it. "It's appointed that man should die once." But maybe he wasn't dead.

[Elliott Jackalope]

Not to be difficult on this highly charged subject, but the fact is that you have both quoted from the same book, and from what I can tell the quotes you have both provided contradict each other.

[plain talk]

I'm just correcting you, not debating you. I can understand why you wish not to debate it because it's obvious you don't understand Christianity by some of your statements. God is sovereign. They are His rules and it doesn't need to conform to man's limited idea of love and mercy. He is not your God and you can't define Him as you wish Him to be. The only way to escape eternation damnation is to accept Christ as your Lord and savior. And to do this while you are alive and have free will. I am not ashamed of the gosepel, are you?

[Taliesan]

I'm relying on the Gospels. Who do YOU think wrote them, and why?

[Woahhs]

"No amount of experimentation can ever prove me right, one single experiement can prove me wrong"

In principle, yes. In practice, scientists are every bit as hidebound as witchdoctors...and that includes Einstein. No body forced him to come up with the "cosmological constant." Again, see my short list for empirical evidence.

[The Right Stuff]

I have two stories, one reported from a pulpit and one that happened to someone I know. The pulpit one was about an elderly lady whose grieving family was gathered at her bedside. Suddenly, she said clearly (waving her arms), "move out of the way, Jesus is reaching for me".

The other story involved our friend Mary, whose husband Freddie had been dead for many years. She lived to be 95. When she died, she said, "Freddy, is that you? Open the door."

Pretty cool, huh?