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Oregon Measure 30 (Tax Increase) Expected to Fail
Various | Recent | Rep. Lane Shetterly, Julie Silverman

Posted on 02/03/2004 11:35:38 AM PST by cogitator

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To: cogitator
Is the state government/state legislature of Oregon wasting too much of the taxpayer's money?

Yes.

And if they don't think they are (wasting the taxpayer's money), can the taxpayers show them where it's being wasted?

Already been done. Nobody is listening.

If you're trying to advocate higher taxes for Oregon, don't.

41 posted on 02/03/2004 5:18:51 PM PST by superloser (Tancredo 2004)
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To: cogitator
List the first five non-essential programs and the first five non-essential services that should be cut, and show the cost savings that accrue from these cuts over the next two years.

How about I start with just one?

Hillsboro School District *borrowed* several million dollars from a bank to build a new state-of-the-art DISTRICT OFFICE for Administrators. Their new high school has an ELEVATED TRACK, not a ground-level one.

The Beaverton School Board gave pay raises with the property tax increase instead of using it on books and programs.

Since you think all of this is 'required' -- defend yourself.

I'm getting my data from the schoolteachers. Where are you getting yours from? The DNC?

42 posted on 02/03/2004 5:21:54 PM PST by superloser (Tancredo 2004)
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To: diamondjoe
The schools in Oregon get an average of $10,000 per student per year right now. That means if there's 25 students per class, each classroom get 250,000 dollars. Why can't Oregon schools teach a class for 250,000 dollars? Oregon spends more on schools per student than both Washington state and California. The problem in Oregon isn't the conservatives, it's the RINO's and Dems.
43 posted on 02/03/2004 5:27:16 PM PST by Tailback
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To: diamondjoe
Oregon ranks pretty low in overall tax burden, actually.

But Oregon is in the top 10 in the country for Per-Capita spending on government. Which means that the fees, permits, and licensing costs much much more in Oregon than elsewhere. Maybe that's why a 3 bedroom 1400 sq/ft home in Salem on a 100' X 80' lot costs $130,000 I could get a larger house with a pool on an acre in Texas for less.
44 posted on 02/03/2004 5:34:53 PM PST by Tailback
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To: cogitator
Hey while you're at it, why not throw in the budget for the Oregon Cultural Trust. Then you can break down where the (so-called) dedicated transportation funds collected as gas tax were spent on things not dealing with automobile transportation like bike paths, hiking trails, light rail and landscaping. You need to go back to DU and the Oregonlive boards where you belong.
45 posted on 02/03/2004 5:41:40 PM PST by Tailback
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To: cogitator
"...if they don't pay them these high salaries, apparently the best superintendents can find places that will."

I most seriously doubt it!

Do you really think that a suitable president can't be found for the University of Oregon for a salary less than $660,000/year?

46 posted on 02/03/2004 8:16:37 PM PST by nightdriver
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To: cogitator
I voted NO! no more state income tax increases!! this chicks had it. our property taxes went up over 500.00 this year. im not in a compassionate mood with the bums and ner do wells living at this families expense.my husband works hard for every dollar,its time for the bums to find gainful employment. my kids nor i have any health insurance we go to the dr. we pay cash,insurance isnt a right and im tired of paying for others to have insurance that we ourselves cannot afford.
im tired of being browbeat about the services being cut,service is pretty crappy now.getting real sick of the emotional blackmail from the schools,go ahead cut class days back i can teach my kids more in one week than the teachers do in a month. NO MORE TAX HIKES!! we cannot afford it any longer,the state killed the goose that laid thier golden egg way back in the 80's so now they can learn to deal with it./rant off
47 posted on 02/03/2004 8:30:53 PM PST by suzyq5558 (WARNING! this tagline does not dial 911..........)
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To: diamondjoe
Do you live here? buzz off..........
48 posted on 02/03/2004 8:31:57 PM PST by suzyq5558 (WARNING! this tagline does not dial 911..........)
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To: cogitator
RIGHT ON!! you said it all.
49 posted on 02/03/2004 8:33:24 PM PST by suzyq5558 (WARNING! this tagline does not dial 911..........)
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To: Eala
Well, I am impressed. Even here in liberal Oregon!!

Tomorrow the bleeding hearts will be all over the airwaves and in the classrooms.

50 posted on 02/03/2004 9:11:50 PM PST by CT (Clinton Soup: kleptocracy, with a few hundred extra dashes of treason and wanton deceit.)
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To: cogitator
Here's the "Republican" legislator who wants to confiscate more money from Oregonians in order to help the scumbag Democrats continue to fund their vote-buying:

Rep. Lane Shetterly, R-Dallas, is speaker pro tem and chairman of the House Revenue Committee. He can be reached at (503) 623-0324.

Anybody who lives in this clown's district should already be chomping at the bit to throw the scumbag OUT.

51 posted on 02/03/2004 9:26:37 PM PST by Lancey Howard
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To: 6ppc
Sounds like there is some pretty blunt education of legislators going on...kind of like what happened here in Alabama!

Ha! You got that right. Same thing in Tennessee. Remember how the sky was gonna fall if the scumbag politicians couldn't get their filthy hands on more of other people's money? Well, the sky didn't fall.

52 posted on 02/03/2004 9:37:00 PM PST by Lancey Howard
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To: cogitator; All
Measure 30 (the tax increase) is failing by a 60%-40% margin. This is with about 880,000 votes counted (79% of total votes).

In a shameless promotion of my post, I have started a new thread with the most recent election returns posted here

53 posted on 02/03/2004 9:51:04 PM PST by eeman
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To: cogitator

http://www.noblankchecks.com/

Top 10 Reasons to Oppose

#2 - The real aim of the Blank Check Initiative is to make it easier for the legislature to increase our income tax, sales tax, property tax, car tax, and other state taxes, year after year. Prop. 56 pretends to discipline Sacramento politicians, but it actually rewards them with an open-ended blank check.

54 posted on 02/03/2004 9:53:38 PM PST by budman_2001
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To: eeman
Congratulations to the citizens of Oregon for standing up to the shameless money-grabbing legislators you elected. I sincerely hope that your anti-tax stand will be an outstanding example to the rest of the states in this great nation. We will be watching closely to observe the future success of the schools, businesses, counties, and cities in your beautiful state. Good luck to you all!

55 posted on 02/04/2004 8:09:32 AM PST by cogitator
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To: nightdriver
Do you really think that a suitable president can't be found for the University of Oregon for a salary less than $660,000/year?

I'm not in a position to judge. First of all, I was talking about school system superintendents, not university presidents. Second, university presidents have a job that's a lot like the CEO of a major corporation: they have to do administration, lobby for funds from the state, attract donors, make short-term and long-term plans, discipline unruly coaches (I had to toss that in), determine where the university should have high-profile programs (like biotechnology or Latin classics, etc.) -- in short, they do a lot of things. A really good university president can definitely affect the fortunes of a school, which also goes for a really bad university president.

Here's an idea. Evaluate the total budget of the University of Oregon, and determine what size of company is similar. Then see what they are paying the CEOs of companies that size. Should you pay a university president an approximately equivalent amount?

56 posted on 02/04/2004 8:40:55 AM PST by cogitator
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To: cogitator
"Here's an idea. Evaluate the total budget of the University of Oregon, and determine what size of company is similar."

So would you also use that criteria for the office of Governor of the entire State of Oregon? U. of O. president gets $660,000, the governor gets something like $90,000.

57 posted on 02/04/2004 9:03:41 AM PST by nightdriver
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To: nightdriver
So would you also use that criteria for the office of Governor of the entire State of Oregon? U. of O. president gets $660,000, the governor gets something like $90,000.

No, I wouldn't even use the salary of the POTUS, which is $400,000 (I believe). In my mind, a university (even public university) is more like a corporation than a government department, and the position of a university president is a lot different than a standard civil-service position. As an example, numerous Cabinet members have left multi-million dollar positions to serve the government for much lower salaries; government positions are not compensated fairly for what they demand, and the people who take those positions do them for reasons other than monetary gain. In contrast, a university president should be compensated for doing his job well, and while the criteria by which success would be judged is different than for a private corporation, success in this realm should still be compensated at market value.

[Note before proceeding: this is a different argument than for a public school system superintendent. While I think that such positions should be compensated fairly, I also think that the bidding for so-called "top talent" is spiraling out of control, and there are good (i.e., bad) examples of that here in Maryland.]

Not knowing the numbers, I Googled on "university president salaries". Very interesting results:

Top College President Salaries Approaching $1 Million, New Survey Reports

Excerpted:

"While pay for public university presidents still has not reached those heights, the salary gap between public and private college leaders is rapidly shrinking, according to the report. Twelve public university presidents will earn more than $500,000 in 2003-4, twice the number of last year. "

The article also notes that states only pay a portion of the salaries of university presidents for public universities. "In reaction to the rising presidential salaries, some state governments have proposed capping the state contribution to public presidential salaries. Florida has already imposed a cap on the state contribution, while a bill under consideration in Ohio would limit state contributions to presidential salaries to the same salary as the governor."

That seems reasonable.

One more article:

UF president to be among highest paid in the nation

Excerpting a couple of paragraphs; pay attention to the last one:

"GAINESVILLE - Incoming University of Florida president Bernie Machen could make up to an average of $685,625 annually if he stays eight years and meets goals set by the school's trustees.

That salary package would make him among the most highly paid public university presidents in the country, according to a Sunday report in the Gainesville Sun, which obtained a draft of his contract."

...

"Last year, state lawmakers set a $225,000 limit on the amount of public money that can be spent annually on a president's salary.

UF equally will tap three direct support organizations to pay Machen beyond the cap: the UF Foundation, the University Athletic Association and Shands Healthcare, said Manny Fernandez, the UF trustee who recruited Machen."

....

"If you want to be in the top 10 among public universities in rankings, he ought to be compensated at that level," Fernandez said. "You are talking about running a very complex $3-billion company here."

58 posted on 02/04/2004 10:32:41 AM PST by cogitator
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To: judgeandjury
because they want to scare you into voting for more taxes by cutting police, fire, and school services.

if they actually cut waste they couldn't blackmail you into voting for more taxes.
59 posted on 02/04/2004 7:34:31 PM PST by Nayt2 (this must be new)
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