Not Nixon's War - Something Else (John Kerry's Killing Fields)

MensNewsDaily ^ | Jan.27, 2004 | Bruce Walker

[WilliamofCarmichael]

RE: "Nice twist, but overly simplistice and not believeable to people who have lived through (or even read about) the Vietnam war."

What part is not believable? Did you "live through or even read (and what did you read?) about the Vietnam war."

[WilliamofCarmichael]

Real or not it was the mainstream media's habit of describing the Viet Cong flag as a "red, blue, and yellow" protest banner.
So being photographed with a "protest" banner was no big deal.

[binger]

[Nix 2]

Did Jane Fonda commit treason by sitting on a tank outside the Hanoi Hilton that was full of American POWs? If so, then Kerry is all the more because he was there and he knew what she did, but came back and joined her. Got our guys murdered.
BS to "misguided." CHILDREN are misguided. Kerry was a traitor and a liar. For that matter, if he could GET worse, he is now because he is using those lies to call himself a hero and try to lay claim to the White House as Commander in Chief of the country he so desparaged...
Hefner and Playboy built him from the ground up. Welcome to the *mansion.*

[RLK]

Kerry simply lacks any personal integrity.

[jonno]

bump.

[Jaxter]

It's probably Photoshopped. But that doesn't change the fact that Kerry was on the VC/NVA side. I found the pic and other Kerry info here.

[Zeroisanumber]

If so, then Kerry is all the more because he was there and he knew what she did, but came back and joined her. Got our guys murdered.

It's obvious that you're passionate about Vietnam and about Vietnam protestors. However you might feel about the subject, the average American (that magical 7.5% of the voters who decide the election) believes that the Vietnam war was immoral, stupid, and wasteful. War protestors (well...not Jane Fonda) are generally seen as noble, idealistic, and on the side of right. No one is going to believe that John Kerry and the other war protestors "murdered" anybody, and our saying so isn't going to make it any easier for Bush to get re-elected.

Christ man, what are you going to say when Kerry spins this back as a "Veterans benefits" thing? When he has Ron freaking Kovic rolling up to the microphone to speak about how bad things were at VA hospitals before VVAW and how things improved thanks to Kerry and others like him?

How, in a nation that has been brought up to despise the wrongness of the Vietnam war, are you going to attack Kerry from the right? This is not going to work, and could very well spin back on us.

[NeonKnight]

I think the only leg this story has is Kerrys contention that it was 'Nixons war.' That is a lie. Not only didn't Nixon start that war, he pulled us out of it. I am not sure what logic he is using...but I would like to see someone ask him in a debate.

[Zeroisanumber]

I think the only leg this story has is Kerrys contention that it was 'Nixons war.' That is a lie. Not only didn't Nixon start that war, he pulled us out of it. I am not sure what logic he is using...but I would like to see someone ask him in a debate.

Blah...Vietnam wasn't Nixon's war, but since Kerry's a Democrat he uses the Republican as a convienient donkey to pin it on. Not too unusual, when you think about it we did the same thing to Clinton over Somalia.

[NeonKnight]

Yes, Somalia was an odd little adventure that nobody really understood anyway. I do hold daddy Bush responsible for that one. I know it was sold as humanitarian...but there was no real plan to solve the crises. I don't think Marines can do much about poverty. But it was nowhere near the scale of VN. I think we lost around 20 lives.

[Nix 2]

You are nuts, man. Clinton changed the Mission in Somalia. What happened in Mogadishu can be lain directly at his feet. Don't try to teach a history you don't know anything about. So far, you have defended a traitor, (Kerry) defended another traitor, (Clinton,) and frankly, I am beginning to wonder about YOU! Zero is a very good number if you are counting nothing.

[Nix 2]

It was Clinton that decided we would not protect ourselves in Somalia, not Bush. Clinton was about *nation building.* Bush was about delivering food to starving people, but he didn't leave our troops in the lurch without the necessary means to defend themselves. Clinton did. Do some history.

[NeonKnight]

I know Clinton changed the mission in Somalia, but what was the original mission? The whole thing was a mistake.

[NeonKnight]

When we start using the Marines for humanitarian missions, we are abusing the Marines. It's not what they do. I liked George H W Bush, but sending the Marines to Somalia was a mistake.

[Nix 2]

How, in a nation that has been brought up to despise the wrongness of the Vietnam war..

What nation might that be? The war wasn't wrong. The politicians who RAN it were wrong, and more than several were criminally wrong. But the war was right, and we should have, would have won had it not been the political correctness of pols scared of the reallll far left. It was Walter Cronkite who almost singlehandedly turned the Tet Victory into an *American Loss.* History is a b*tch. The truth doesn't change no matter how you spin it.

[NeonKnight]

Actually, we did win. They picked the wrong side. The Soviet Union no longer exists, and the Chinese have nothing but contempt for the Vietnamese.

Meanwhile, most countries that have chosen to side with the US are doing quite well.

[Zeroisanumber]

You are nuts, man. Clinton changed the Mission in Somalia. What happened in Mogadishu can be lain directly at his feet. Don't try to teach a history you don't know anything about. So far, you have defended a traitor, (Kerry) defended another traitor, (Clinton,) and frankly, I am beginning to wonder about YOU!

I'm not going to debate the rightness or wrongness of the Bush41/Clinton produced idiocy that lead up to the debacle in Somalia. We shouldn't have been there (Bush41), and we shouldn't have stayed (Clinton). The point of my post had absolutely nothing to do with who did what, but rather when it was done.

Much like Somalia, the Vietnam war was a monumental waste of good men, money, time, and effort. It was a stupid attempt to fight a stupid war for the stupid French under suicidal restrictions. In my humble and rational opinion we should take those responsible for starting, promoting, and refusing to end the goddamn debacle, flambe them and dump their bodies into a sewage canal (this goes for both Vietnam AND Somalia).

Guys like Kerry and Kovic are on the other side of the aisle from me, we disagree about things like guns, economics, and the need to sometimes drop bombs and shoot people; but in the case for Vietnam, they were spot on. They wern't traitors, I'm certainly not a traitor, and I'm pretty sick of being called one by armchair jurists with a Tom Clancy novel understanding of politics, and history.

[WilliamofCarmichael]

RE: "Not too unusual, when you think about it we did the same thing to Clinton over Somalia."

Okay, you cannot substantiate your Vietnam feeeeeeeeeeeeelings (see my post above, please), how about Somalia? President Bush sent aid there owing almost entirely to CNN's wall-to-wall coverage of the very real human problems there.

Later under Clinton it bacame a "nation building" effort. Remember the issue of "mission creep?"

"we did the same thing to Clinton over Somalia" is simply wrong. Yes, there was justified criticism of Clinton but saying "we did the same thing to Clinton over Somalia" vis-a-vis conservative crticism of 1960s liberals is wrong.

[NeonKnight]

There is still a humanitarian crises in Somalia. You wanna send in the Marines? If it is not a good idea now, why was it a good idea then? I said I liked GHWB, but if you are going to claim he did it because of CNN coverage, I may have to rethink it.