Who says George W. Bush has done "nothing" for conservatives?

WhiteHouse.gov; various news sources ^ | 1/27/04

[Howlin]

What good does it do to presume, incorrectly, that all is well and Panglossian with President Bush and the Republican Party?

Nobody has to presume anything; in fact, it's quite true; poll after poll has proven it.

Now, as we enter another voting season, the Gallup Organization has released a study, based on 40,000 interviews, that shows that 45.5 percent of voters identify with or lean toward the Republican Party and 45.2 percent identify with or lean toward the Democratic Party.

So is that it? After Sept. 11, the Iraq war and the Madonna-Britney kiss, could it really be that we are back to where we started? Since 2000, tens of millions of people have moved, divorced and converted; can it really be that everything in America changes except politics?

Yes and no. Yes, the political divides today do look a lot like the ones that split the nation in 2000. But no. When you look beneath the headline data, you see at least one important change. The events of the past three years have brought to the foreground issues that divide Democrats, and pushed to the background issues that divide Republicans.

The first result is that the Republican Party is more unified than ever before. Ninety-one percent of Republicans approve of the job President Bush is doing. In 1992, Bush's father didn't have anything like that level of support, and even the Reagan administration was split between so-called pragmatists and ideologues.

Today's Republicans not only like Bush personally, they also overwhelmingly support his policies. According to a Pew Center study, 85 percent of Republicans support the war in Iraq, 82 percent believe that pre-emptive war is justified, and 72 percent believe the U.S. is justified in holding terror suspects without trial.

The Bush Democrats

[Sabertooth]

I think there are more of Group 1 than you allow, for more and deeper reasons than you allow.

I think there are less than Group 2 than you do.

I think Group 3 spends far too much time pretending about Group 2 rather than dealing with the larger Group 1, because it's easy. In my observation, Group 3's track record is fairly marginal in identifying legitimate 2s.

But here's the thing: to whatever extent I might be wrong about the proportions of 1 and 2, 3 is better off approaching them both as they would 1. 2s are unpersuadable anyway, but 1s are always unimpressed when 3s are witch-hunting for 2s. It hinders the message.

[Texasforever]

I wonder who this "freeper" is?

marie123 (21 posts)	Tue Jan-27-04 11:01 AM Response to Original message
17. well if it makes

you feel better, the SOB no longer has my vote. I cant begin to tell you my disappointment in all of this, but I can tell you I am not alone in my thinking with other freepers. They are just afraid to come out of the closet. After all, in kind of sucks being very wrong Hang on, more of us will come over

[PhiKapMom]

That's my take too -- too many posters talked about going 3rd Party -- looks like a lot of them have never been around a campaign before either. Their dislike for Kerry and Hillary Clinton is there.

[Delphinium]

Believe me,I am not part of the right-most fringe of the "iffy" conservatives I am a team player, and have worked hard for some I consider to be on the RINO side. I have been very sorry a few times that I wasted my precious time

I am not a one issue person but if a man believes its okay for a mother to kill her unborn child then I could never trust him on any other issue.

[Dolphy]

Thanks for posting this. I am so late to this thread that I don't know when I will be able to read the posts. What I do know is that President Bush has exceeded my expectations with his handling of September 11, the recession and steady hand during the Wall Street fiasco. I can't look right or left and identify any person on the national political scene that I believe would have risen to the same heights.

I was proud and excited to work for and cast my vote for George W. Bush in 2000. I will be all that and more come November.

[Howlin]

One of these 19 percent:

Question ...

---

Please rate the president's State of the Union Address:

Excellent - 42%

Good - 38%

Poor - 9%

Failure - 5%

Undecided - 5%

And do you really care?

[Joe Hadenuf]

I am not a one issue person but if a man believes its okay for a mother to kill her unborn child then I could never trust him on any other issue.

I tend to agree with that. It's like a politician watching our country being completely over run with people pouring in illegally by the millions, and then suggests a plan to reward them. Makes it kind of hard to trust him on any other issues. These are not just minor, small single issues. Few issues are larger, or more dangerous.

[Sabertooth]

Sorry ,I had to scrape my shoes off after that one.

Yeah?

Tell you what... see if you can find any post of mine where I've advocated any third party, let alone the Constitution Party, over the GOP.

Before you waste your time, you might ask a few people.

Here, I'll flag some.

[Tamzee]

Are "brigadiers and the perotistas" or "your buddies at DU" aromatherapy? I don't get it.

You are serious, aren't you? You mean well, Saber, and you genuinely try to be fair and honest, but many here that are taking your exact political position are NOT trying to be fair OR honest. Many are repeating criticisms of Bush that we see aimed at him from DU. Someone at FR today said that Bush lied about WMD's and took us to war on false pretenses. Also, many folks screaming about the guest worker proposal are advocating voting for a third party. I know you haven't promoted this, but many are who are repeating your posts or taking heart from your position.

Not your fault, I know, but there are so many here lately that advocate voting for an opposition party that it is difficult to tell who are genuine political allies.

[JackelopeBreeder]

The first result is that the Republican Party is more unified than ever before. Ninety-one percent of Republicans approve of the job President Bush is doing.

I'd bet a very large amount that statement wouldn't pass the laugh test here in Arizona. About a week ago, the RNC and GOP claimed that Phoenix and Maricopa County were critical to re-election. Of course that was before the state-level GOP kicked them to the curb over Dubya's illegal alien scamnesty.

[gatorbait]

Before you waste your time, you might ask a few people

That's okay,you already have and already are.

[Tamzee]

I am not a one issue person but if a man believes its okay for a mother to kill her unborn child then I could never trust him on any other issue.

Uhhh.. then YES you are a one-issue person. It's fine with me, I'm not criticizing that you hold that position... just realize that you are in fact basing your entire chunk of political power on that ONE issue versus the entire remainder of that politicians platform.

[potlatch]

[Joe Hadenuf]

Also, many folks screaming about the guest worker proposal are advocating voting for a third party.

Correction, it's slow motion, incremental amnesty. The term you used, "guest worker program" is so evading and governmentesque. It has "bravo sierra" written all over it.

[gatorbait]

Tell you what... see if you can find any post of mine where I've advocated any third party, let alone the Constitution Party, over the GOP.

So you'll know,Saber,I did not say you advocated third party;I did say you indulge in screeds. You also get personal then get offended when you get hit back. So,again, some, in fact, many of the things you post I find myself in agreement with.Your tendency for thin skin and fighting to get in the last word,however, detracts from it.

Thanks for the call for help.You need all you can gather.

[Texasforever]

Do you feel it yet? The slip slip slipping away of your 10 minutes in the sun? LOL

[Joe Hadenuf]

Uhhh.. then YES you are a one-issue person. It's fine with me, I'm not criticizing that you hold that position... just realize that you are in fact basing your entire chunk of political power on that ONE issue versus the entire remainder of that politicians platform.

Regarding domestic issues, what issue could be larger, more dangerous than literally millions of people entering illegally, creating epic national fraud, crime, taking jobs, choking off social services etc etc? What domestic issue would you consider to be more dangerous to our country?

[Sabertooth]

**What good does it do to presume, incorrectly, that all is well and Panglossian with President Bush and the Republican Party?

**Nobody has to presume anything; in fact, it's quite true; poll after poll has proven it.

You didn't link to a Panglossian poll.

Ever read Voltaire? In Candide, one of the main characters was Dr. Pangloss, a teacher of metaphysico-theologo-cosmolonigology, who was prone to saying things like:

"It is demonstrable," said he, "that things cannot be otherwise than as they are; for as all things have been created for some end, they must necessarily be created for the best end. Observe, for instance, the nose is formed for spectacles, therefore we wear spectacles. The legs are visibly designed for stockings, accordingly we wear stockings. Stones were made to be hewn and to construct castles, therefore My Lord has a magnificent castle; for the greatest baron in the province ought to be the best lodged. Swine were intended to be eaten, therefore we eat pork all the year round: and they, who assert that everything is right, do not express themselves correctly; they should say that everything is best."
Candide - Voltaire
Chapter 1 - How Candide Was Brought Up in a Magnificent Castle and How He Was Driven Thence

Dr. Pangloss was not an accurate reporter of the real world, and incessentaly put forth that we live in the best of all possible worlds.

There was never any room for improvement in any circumstance.

So, I'll stand by the statement that it is incorrect to presume that "that all is well and Panglossian with President Bush and the Republican Party." It's not especially daring.

You don't?

Is there no room for improvement with President Bush and the Republican Party?

[Joe Hadenuf]

Do you feel it yet? The slip slip slipping away of your 10 minutes in the sun?

A little off topic again eh Tex?