Who says George W. Bush has done "nothing" for conservatives?

WhiteHouse.gov; various news sources ^ | 1/27/04

[FirstPrinciple]

Obviously, you didn't learn economics. Drugs are expensive today, because they are illegal. If drugs were legal, they would be much cheaper and would be marketed by Pfizer and Bayer. In fact, Bayer used to make the best heroine until it was made illegal. Please pick up a basic book on economics.

[templar]

Drop the sarcasm, cutie,...

You and I have nothing in common, honey. We are on different sides. We are enemies.

[Sabertooth]

Saber, the road to hell is paved with good intentions.

From your #1093:

"I say he must have a damn good reason to be taking such a great political risk. I've given this a great deal of thought and it seems to me as if Bush's primary reason for taking such a gamble even despite the loud screams of protest is because he honestly feels it is important for national security."

I've already shown that Bush has always wanted Amnesty.

Whatever his reasons, the Illegal Alien Road paved with the intentions of President Bush is the road best left not taken.

Your extremely vocal and overwhelmingly visible opposition to his proposal (and what you ASSUME will be part of his proposal) is going a long way to building up the vote-against-President-Bush-ers.

Since I have been proven correct, that President Bush would propose an Amnesty for IIllegal Aliens, and those complaining now that folks like me, who won't just "shut up and vote" for him, have been proven wrong all along to deny that he would, I see no reason now why I should be quiet.

President Bush's Amnesty is the problem here, not me. I've warned about it here for years, and folks wanted to live in make-believe. Now his Amnesty is upon us, and folks still want to play make-believe.

Some of us have been warning for years that this issue had the potential to damage prospects for the President and the GOP in 2004. The fact that there is now such cause for concern for precisely the reasons we've said, is a remarkable reason for folks to expect us now to be silent.

Folks who've hidden their heads in the sand the past few years have lost all credibility in this forum on the Illegal Alien issue, except amongst themselves. There is now a panic over it, because they can no longer pretend to control the debate.

There has been a mob mentality against him and the GOP lately and you are a standard bearer for that group whether you intend to be or not.

There has been a mob mentality to give the President a pass on every matter, regardless of how bad a given policy might be.

CFR would be OK, were were told.

"Bush is taking the Democrats' issues away! SCOTUS will fix it.! Strategery!"

All wrong, all nonsense, and I said so at the time.

The nation, the President, and the GOP are not well-served by the effort to stifle criticism of bad ideas coming from his Administration.

I've paid close attention to your posts and, while I find you very frustrating with the distorted way (in my opinion) that you view this and the distorted value (in my opinion) that you place on this issue, I do believe you are entirely genuine and trying to fair.

Thanks. I think you make a sincere effort to be fair as well.

I also hold a personal opinion that you are some type of eccentric genius. One thing puzzling to me is whether you are the 80 year-old wise wizard you appear to be at times or the 13 year old idealist you appear on other occasions... would you take pity on me and satisfy my curiousity?

You're very kind. I'm just a young single dad of a teenage daughter.

At long last I come to my point.... I do like YOUR plan for handling the illegal immigrants and would rather have it over what I understand Bush's to be, but I also believe that Bush must have reasons to propose the solution he did and I am willing to wait and see where it goes.

Thanks.

I am not willing to wait, however, because I already know where it's going.

Amnesty for Illegals must be opposed at every opportunity and stopped cold.

I think you are damaging critical support for him here and his "conservative" base allowing Kerry into office will have more severe consequences for America than 100 million illegal Mexicans could ever have.

Where I disagree with your analysis, is that the President's Amnesty is actually the thing most likely (and I personally still think it's unlikely) to put John Kerry in the White House. "Wait and see" is the part of the problem, not part of the solution. That's been true all along.

The President's Amnesty is what's damaging critical support. It's a political and policy disaster, and the indications are that he intends to pursue it.

Therefore, on both politics and policy, I will continue to hold firm against it.

[Peach]

Cheaper! Is it cheaper to have a large citizenry addicted to drugs and all the accompanying problems? I think not. Non productive citizens cost us all in lost productivity, loss of jobs and non-paying tax citizens, crime - which becomes rampant to pay for the cost of drugs.

Even in countries where drugs are legal - as I mentioned earlier - have RAMPANT crime among the drug users. Regardless of how cheap drugs are, the addicted generally cannot work and drugs aren't free. They find other ways to support their habit.

Again, I urge you to do a little research on those countries who have made drugs legal. You will be quite surprised as your argument will be found baseless.

[FirstPrinciple]

The problem with Sweden and Norway is not that they have legalized narcotics, but that they have a welfare state. If drug addicts know that they can get their fix from the state along with food, clothing and housing, you bet they will. I want a society where drugs are legal, but noone in the right mind will abuse it because they have to internalize the cost.

[Peach]

Your information is wrong according to the article I've read.

Drugs are legalized in some of those countries and the problems are huge.

But I don't expect to change your mind, only inform others who may be reading your ridiculous arguments.

[FirstPrinciple]

Has anyone who ever met you taken you seriously?

Only the ones with something between their ears.

[FirstPrinciple]

What kind of problems? Tell me their problems do not come from the fact that they have a welfare state. Sweden and Norway are unproductive countries because of socialism and has nothing to do with narcotics. Narcotics were legal in this country, until the War on Drugs started. Don't tell me we were unproductive before that.

[Peach]

You have not read the articles I have read about the drug problems in those countries. Go read a little and then report back.

[FirstPrinciple]

Obviously you haven't read anything I have written. You are just spouting off the regular war on drugs rhetoric. No one is encouraging anyone to do drugs, except for politicians who want drugs to be banned. Of course, drugs are bad for you. But there are tons of stuff that are bad for you. We cannot ban everything that is bad for health. McDonalds does more harm than drugs. Rap music, pornography all have debilitating effect on life. We cannot ban everything. People should be free to choose what they want to put in their body. If you don't like it, don't do it. Unless a drug addict comes to harm you, the state has no right to prevent that person from doing drugs.

[FirstPrinciple]

You haven't been to Scandinavia. I have. I know what is screwed up here, and drugs aren't the first thing. Open your mind, maybe you will learn something.

[PhiKapMom]

Excuse me but do you know the definition of the word RINO?

In case you don't, it stands for Republican in Name Only -- it doesn't stand for Conservative in Name Only.

That is where all of your arguments on here go downhill when you refer to President Bush as a RINO. He is Republican, he is conservative, but because he isn't conservative enough for you, you call him a RINO. That says more about you then it ever will about this President.

We "RINO's" as some of you like to call us can be depended on to support the President even if we happen to disagree on an issue here or there. My #1 priority is Defense! He has done an outstanding job with taking the fight to the terrorist on their own turf instead of being wimpy and having the UN talk about doing something. If President Bush hadn't taken the fight to the terrorist, we wouldn't have to worry about the parts of his agenda you don't like.

[deport]

Hey ..... CCF, a little bump your way....... Care to tell us who we should vote for? Come on it's your turn you know.

[onyx]

The blue triangle represents the self-decribed BASE, standing on its "pouting-purist-point."

[Peach]

I've been there. I won't convince you. That's okay. Just don't want others taken in by your propoganda.

[RiflemanSharpe]

I have many priorites (there are about 11-12)I give them all equal weight and I use these to decide should I support a candidate. Bush I found is week in the majority of them. This is why I can no longer support him.

[FirstPrinciple]

I highly doubt it. If you did then you would know that it is not like what you are describing. How many drug addicts did you see laying on the streets of Helsinki and Stockholm? You would also know why their productivity is so low and it has nothing to do with drugs. If you are talking about crime, do you feel safer in the streets of NYC or in Stockholm? Which city has a higher crime rate, even after adjusting for population, NYC or Stockholm? If you actually been there, you would know the answer.

[FirstPrinciple]

Don't argue with people who just won't see why someone may have a problem with Bush. There are a lot of people here who are personally benefiting from Bush's big govt agenda. I want them to vote their personal interest over the interest of the nation.

[Miss Marple]

My daughter spent the summer in Europe a year ago. She was appalled at Amsterdam (legal drugs and prostitution). It was dirty and full of crime...NOT what one would think of Holland, nor what the anti-WOD people would lead us to believe. Addicts on the streets, prostitutes in windows, sex toys on display, pickpockets rampant (in fact they had a recorded announcement when you got off the train to beware pickpockets). Creepy people on every street corner...to the point that she felt like she needed to buy hand sanitizer.

So don't tell me about how much better things could be if we legalized drugs. That is a crock and I'm not buying it.

[cyncooper]

You're sitting here declaring fellow freepers enemies?

Good grief.