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To: Dolphy
"Bush Sr. jumped over the line and we had to whack him," said Grover G. Norquist, president of Americans for Tax Reform and a strategist of the conservative movement. This guy calls himself a strategist? What a laugh.

An aside, but wasn't Norquist involved in a pro Arabist oranization? I am not certain but it may well have been posted here. Bob Barr? Let's see, is he not up to his elbows with the ACLU now? You know, the Patiot Act has yet to result in anyone's free speech rights being abridged, nor anyone dragged into Ashcroft's prayer meeting/torture chamber. Ah well, snivel rights panderers seem to like having an enemy to whine about. Whingers(Whining fringers) seem to love this kind of thing, and the NYT is happy to give them a megaphone to shout out their deluded rantings.

29 posted on 01/24/2004 9:54:56 PM PST by gatorbait (Yesterday, today and tomorrow......The United States Army)
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To: gatorbait
An aside, but wasn't Norquist involved in a pro Arabist oranization? I am not certain but it may well have been posted here. Bob Barr? Let's see, is he not up to his elbows with the ACLU now? You know, the Patiot Act has yet to result in anyone's free speech rights being abridged, nor anyone dragged into Ashcroft's prayer meeting/torture chamber.

I have also read that Norquist lobbied for an organization with Arab sympathies.

With the exception of the First Amendment clause mentioning of freedom of religion, turning it into freedom from religion, and the Second Amendment, which they misinterpret for whatever reason, the ACLU almost always goes all the way to uphold the Constitution as they see it. They were on the same side as the NRA opposing the McCain-Fiengold Campaign Finance Reform on the basis of freedom of speech.

U.S. Constitution: Fourth Amendment(Search and Seizure)

Amendment Text

The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no Warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by Oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized.

The Patriot Act seriously infringes on the Fourth Amendment not the First, IIRC. Ashcroft and Co. said it would use its provisions only in cases that involved terrorism, but they have already broken their word. I have read a number of stories about using the Patriot Act as cover for routine criminal cases, in particular, one in Las Vegas, IIRC. The feds have used its provisions to invade privacy and then go to a federal judge after the fact to obtain authorization. That means they can monitor your activities, wait until you have left your house, inspect all of your personal possessions, install bugs to monitor all of your private communications, all before obtaining a warrant. I'm not terribly worried about the Bush administration using this authority, but what do you think a Hillary administration might do with it?

Mr. Cheney took the podium shortly after Representative F. James Sensenbrenner Jr., the Wisconsin Republican who heads the House Judiciary Committee, vowed that extending the act before reviewing its results by 2005 would happen "over my dead body."

Sensenbrenner is no liberal pantywaist.

40 posted on 01/25/2004 12:10:33 AM PST by neverdem (Xin loi min oi)
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To: gatorbait; All
"wasn't Norquist involved in a pro Arabist organization"

Hmm, yeah you might say so (The Islamic Institute). Here's a link to a letter (.pdf) that I find a good read about, and addressed to Mr. Norquist. It's dated 2-7-03 after last year's CPAC. Center For Security Policy

NOTE: I have broadband so the loading time was ok, but over a phone line it might take a while.

46 posted on 01/25/2004 7:39:59 AM PST by Condor51 ("Leftists are moral and intellectual parasites." -- Standing Wolf)
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