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To: Sabertooth
Anyway, legalizaing Illegals is Amnesty for Illegals.

Most people understand this, and giving Illegals blue cards before green cards before citizenship is just the lipstick on the pig.

I don't buy this argument. Sure, I'd like them, as current law says, to have to go back home to apply, but we already have guest worker programs and I wonder how many "illegals" are counted as illegal that are currently in these programs. I know many businesses that use this program.

Also, it at least, if enforced, makes them go to some government agency to at least get documented and it takes 3-9 years as a "guest" before they can even consider trying to become a citizen.

So what we are back to arguing is the level of LEGAL immigration we are willing to accept and given the 8-12 million classified as illegal today (let's average that to 10 million) over the last 20 years, that's 500,000 a year. Too many? Not enough? I don't know.

I also sympathize with those from other places that aren't Mexico that DO come here and legally go through the INS and have to spend years and thousands of dollars to become citizens. It's not fair. But that doesn't address the problem as we have it.

Deport them all? Sure, let's do it. The cost would be ungodly but maybe many would leave on their own. Fine the businesses that hire them illegally, YES! We should be doing that now because it's the law.

But I think something has to be done and Bush is at least willing to put the poker in the fire and have the debate, something we haven't seen since 1984 leading up to the 1986 amnesty. But I don't see this as amnesty if it takes over 9 years to even start becoming a citizen. That alone proves it's not amnesty and is just trying to fix the problem that has festered for 20 years. If we made marijuana legal today, it's not giving amnesty to those that illegally smoked it in the past.

Again, it, to me, comes down to a debate on how many immigrants we want to allow in every year and how many new citizens from foreign countries we want. And I want it to be equal for all involved regardless of where they come from...Europe, Asia, Mexico, South America, Africa, etc.

I welcome the debate and I welcome the possibility of working this out. But too many want to proclaim anyone that doesn't agree with them on this issue as an "idiot" or a "moron" or "Bush lover" or "Bush hater" or "anti-American", etc. That doesn't do any good and in my opinion those people ought to be exported out since they don't understand what our country truly stands for...freedom of the individual and ideas.

And I always appreciate your level headed discussion on all topics. Many regards.

3,188 posted on 01/20/2004 10:01:57 PM PST by Fledermaus (Democrats are just not capable of defending our nation's security. It's that simple!)
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To: Fledermaus
Not a bad post .. an actually debate and discussion of the issue ..

It's refreshing .. Thanks
3,193 posted on 01/20/2004 10:06:17 PM PST by Mo1 (Join the dollar a day crowd now!)
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To: Fledermaus
Deport them all? Sure, let's do it. The cost would be ungodly but maybe many would leave on their own. Fine the businesses that hire them illegally, YES! We should be doing that now because it's the law.

But I think something has to be done and Bush is at least willing to put the poker in the fire and have the debate, something we haven't seen since 1984 leading up to the 1986 amnesty.

President Bush didn't start this debate, he's coming late.

The solution, in large part, is self-deportation of Illegal Aliens.

They Will Deport Themselves

There are plenty of steps we can take to do this.

Eighteen Illegal Alien solutions that are better than any Amnesty

Not only is encouragement of Illegal Alien self-deportation humane and cost effective, there has already been considerable success in this regard with Pakistani Illegals.

25% of Pakistani Illegal Aliens Deported Themselves since 2001 -
Facts against the Bush Amnesty

It's a mistake to believe that President Bush's "not an Amnesty" Amnesty is the "only solution," when it's not a solution at all.

The false dilemma behind the Bush Amnesty


3,202 posted on 01/20/2004 10:10:33 PM PST by Sabertooth (Pakistani Illegal Aliens Deport Themselves - http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1058591/posts)
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