Mark Steyn: We are falling under the imam's spell

The Telegraph (U.K.) ^ | 01/13/04 | Mark Steyn

[Rummyfan]

Agreed. Thanks!

[Dr.Deth]

"Islam is a social creed above all, a radically different way of organising society as a whole."

In other words: Islam is a political movement, as much as a religion, and it must be dealt with as such.

Close, but not quite. Islam is a

---> CULT <---

and it must be dealt with as such. What, but a cult, is religion, social creed, and a different way of organising society?

Even Steyn knows to avoid the 'other' C-word. Any non-equivocal assertion of the obvious would most certainly be fatwa-worthy.

A side observation: It's amazing how the prosaic level rises to a higher standard for Steyn threads. The man is a profoundly good influence!

[bereanway]

Amen. Islam by definition is the problem. Their source documents in particular are the problem and give overwhelming theological, theoretical and legal support to the so called radicals as Spencer correctly points out.

This isn't about reformation, this is about the essence of a belief system which by its very definition is incompatible with any alternate worldview. Assimilation really isn't an option for a true Muslim, only a perception until the numbers are more to their liking.

[Cuttnhorse]

...many in the West don't understand Islam in terms of its relationship to society as a whole. You can't separate the two. Even in the most liberal Islamic societies, tolerance of other religions and viewpoints that run counter to Islam is marginal at best.

Very well said.

[knighthawk]

Ping

[stands2reason]

Monticellicide? ;-)

[pgkdan]

"The Jewish question"? "Notoriously sensitive"? Is this really how they talk at the BBC?

The Jewish Question??? I thought that phrase went out of style in 1945.

[Travis McGee]

MEIN KORAN = MEIN KAMPF

[justshutupandtakeit]

Essentially Alexander Hamilton's arguments in the Croswell case in New York. He lost the case because truth was no defense but his arguments so shamed the NY legislature that after his death later that year (1804) it changed state law wrt libel and slander. Other states began to change as well after NY.

Under the Alien and Sedition Acts, which were federal laws, truth was admitted as a defense. Hypocritical Jeffersonians screamed hysterically about these laws which were far more reasonable than the State laws in effect throughout the nation. These were used to stifle criticism of Jefferson as the Croswell case illustrated.

Hamilton's last service to the nation was to reaffirm its committment to Freedom of the Press through the pleading about four months before his shooting.

[headsonpikes]

There are NO Arabs in the Philippines, Nigeria, Kosovo etc etc etc. NONE. ZERO.

Thank you, Baghdad Bob! ;^)

My point is that without Wahhabi Arab agitation in these venues, terrorism would not be the issue that it is.

[maryz]

So in other words... allow them to wholesale slaughter us because 800 years ago a Pope got it into his head to advance his political ambitions by instituting the Crusades.

As I understand it, the Pope responded to pleas from the Eastern Empire to help them defend against the "expansion" of Islam. As far as I can tell (and I'm no expert), if it hadn't been for the Crusades, we certainly wouldn't be fighting the WOT now -- because we'd all already be Muslim (those of us whose ancestors survived the "expansion," anyway).

[carton253]

I don't have time to really answer your post, but I would disagree with it.

One point I will make: The Pope didn't have fraternal feelings toward the Eastern Empire... One of the many reasons (and there is a list) that he (and it just wasn't one Pope since the Crusades lasted over 200 years) fought was to reconcile the two warring factions of the Church by establishing strong Roman influences in the Greek territories and cause the Roman Church to become the dominant church in the region.

The Crusades were an invasion... not launched at the whole Islam Empire, but against the Holy Land only (to recover the holy relics from the hands of the infidel). This alone would be why I would disagree with your post.

Of course, these two paragraphs are very shallow in regards to history and motivation. Maybe we could discuss it further tomorrow.

[gcruse]

Thanks.

[browardchad]

"Why are you letting Arabs use your religion as a vehicle for destroying your culture and imposing theirs?"

Islam is an Arab creation.

[PLK]

the Arab penchant for suicide bombing, amputations, repression of women and a generally celebratory attitude to September 11

I don't get the amputations part. Am I the only one?

[NovemberCharlie]

Probably the habit of cutting off the hand of a thief.