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... who are prone to using Democrat talking points to smear posters who are concerned about Illegals as anti-immigrant and closet racists.

You have raised such a smear only yesterday that anyone who disagrees with you must be on a mission to parrot Democratic talking points. Anyone can use the same ploy you used, such as claiming someone who says trying to solve illegal immigration in ways they disagree with is so terrible and that President Bush is a traitor, a ruiner of the nation, and a back-stabber, and no conservative ought to vote for him, must be a Democratic operative.

As for racist statements, they do appear all too often on the immigration threads. One has to wonder if Canadians were coming to work illegally rather than Mexicans or Salvadorans, this would hardly be an issue to those who whine about the rule of law being sacrosanct. The underlying impetus they all have are Michael Savage's smears about how these Southern immigrants are the low-class bums of the 3rd world, and how "border-culture-language" are paramount to anything else, including justice and mercy.

You have raised such a smear only yesterday that anyone who disagrees with you must be on a mission to parrot Democratic talking points

No, not "anyone," not by any stretch, only those whose nerves are now being touched, who are, not coincidentally, those to whom I've specifically posted that observation.
You've gotten your chops busted for your baiting, and you're not used to it, but this is an example of the new attempt at evenhandeness by the Moderators on these threads.

I think both of you have valid points here, actually. I think what Sabertooth said, that there are those who "are prone to using Democrat talking points to smear posters who are concerned about Illegals as anti-immigrant and closet racists", is true to an extent. I've seen it. We even had one returning troll show up last night in an incarnation that was doing just this. And I am sure it was just an act- that one has been here before as a rabid Buchananite and a rabid Libertarian and now as a rabid Bushie, and a long history of posting stuff from Indymedia.

But I have seen it go the other way. I have seen words that are commonly used and are not unusual be labelled as Democrat talking points. Now maybe I should sue the liberal media and Al Gore for certain phrasings being injected into the zeigeist, but I know that if someone uses the phrase anti-immigrant it doesn't mean they are trying to channel Paul Begala. It may not be the right label, but it isn't an attempt to make Democrat points.

Part of this effort is for old timers to lose part of the suspicions they have for the motivations of other old timers, even if they feel that their suspicions are well founded. Taking a step back and seeing if sincere debate can emerge from the rubble would be a welcome thing.

One has to wonder if Canadians were coming to work illegally rather than Mexicans or Salvadorans, this would hardly be an issue to those who whine about the rule of law being sacrosanct.

While there may be racist sentiment in occasional comments, the above example is absurd.

If there were 12 million Candians running around America, milling in front of the local 7-11 for work, using Candian ID's as their sole form of documentation, constantly being detained while crossing into Montana and Maine in the dark of night, then there would be huge outcry by the American public.

The only reason there isn't a more vociferous protest against illegals is because the charge of "racism" is leveled against those who raise the issue.