Will Americans support another amnesty?

www.townhall.com ^ | January 5, 2004 | Phyllis Schlafly

[Jack Black]

IS THERE SUCH A THING AS A SIMULTANEOUS NATIONAL REFERENDUM?

In a word, no. We are a Constitutional Republic, not a direct democracy. We are a Federation of States, not a single unified polity. Given this such a national referendum is not in keeping with our Republic's organization and history.

[Jack Black]

The Constitution Party has some reasonable stuff in their platform but they fall into total wack job paranoia about the Federal Reserve Bank. I would have trouble voting for people who take these rantings seriously. Fractional Reserve Banking is one of the main differentiators between western civilization and it's continuous growth and prosperity and Islamic ones with their stagnation and poverty. Any group that doesn't get this doesn't deserve to rule the modern world.

[Alberta's Child]

The aging population "propaganda" is not propaganda at all. In fact, an aging population and low birthrate are two of the major contributors to Japan's 15-year economic malaise.

[Jack Black]

Pat Buchanan's "Death of the West" made a pretty persuasive case that this was so. That 'demographics is destiny' and that declining birth rates doom the west. Of course the USA has rising demographics, but only because of the large number of 3rd world immigrants and their larger families (for a generation or two). Thus are problems are probably less than Europes, where there will literally be no one to pay pensions and take care of old people in 2020 and 2030.

[MissAmericanPie]

I would like to see the evidence and who presented it as being responsible for Japans economic problems.

If it were truly a problem the Fed is certainly solving it by supporting outsourcing of American jobs and manufacturing.

[azhenfud]

"...because their cheap wages eventually force them into assistance programs."

"What a crock of crap."

http://www.cis.org/articles/2001/mexico/means.html

Crap? Do you have anything substantiating your claim?

[Alberta's Child]

Interesting Link

And from "Viewpoint -- Sun Setting on Japan's Economy?" by Mark Gottlieb (IndustryWeek, 9/11/01):

"Japan's birth rate has been in steady decline for years, as women for the first time in the nation's history have begun to delay marriage and childbirth in favor of careers. Thus, the responsibility for repaying the massive government debt that is now being accumulated will eventually fall on the backs of fewer and fewer workers."

"As is true of many other industrialized countries, the Japanese are facing the hard realities of demographics, with increasing numbers of retirees about to hit the post just as the size of the working population falls. Economists and financial analysts estimate that public and private pension plans are underfinanced by as much as $800 billion, which means the government will have to step in to make up the difference. And that means even more deficit spending."

[EagleMamaMT]

Read later.

[Don Joe]

If that was the case in real-world situations, post-war Japan would not have flourished as it did, and China would not currently be eating our lunch.

That's a perfectly valid point, but you must remember that a nation with a strong export economy almost by definition must be a nation with a lower standard of living than the countries where its customers are located. Since the United States currently has the highest standard of living in the world, we are not likely to gain a trade surplus anytime soon.

Wrong. Japan is a much more expensive place to live than the US, and if you speak with any Japanese, and suggest that their standard of living is lower than ours, you're going to find yourself speaking with a very offended, very indignant Japanese.

Japan remains an export economy, by the way.

[Don Joe]

Instead of dying to get Elian Gonzalez to Florida, his mother should have died getting him to Mexico. Then he could have sneaked across the border with the other illegals and would be a free young man today.

Sad, but true.

For some odd reason, President Rove has annointed Vicente Fox with Golden Boy status. Mexico can do no wrong. Mexico must get what it demands, regardless of the costs to our nation.

[CasearianDaoist]

Me too.

[ZULU]

I'm watching Karlville Rove to see if Bush caves into the leftists on Cuba. Castro should have been flushed out of office a long time ago. The Cuban people deserve to be rid of this monster and we deserve to be rid of this nuisance. It should happen to him BEFORE he dies, so he can contemplate some misery in this world before he meets his Maker.

The panderering to Fox is really strange. The efforts of Mexico to recover "their" lost territory in the southwest are transparent to even a Democrat. He must be stopped.

[SevenDaysInMay]

Hell no.

Reagan disgraced the our USA over this perpetual RICO criminality.

GW, as a proven socialist, has much less slack than Reagan over this perpetual RICO criminality.

GW's only bet is that since the Dems are fascists, he may still get the suckers' votes.

We are importing 3rd Worlders at nearly the population of Sweden every month. How many tens of millions of 3rd Worlders do you want in your neighborhood, paid for by your tax dollars while Spanish becomes the language of their barrios, your old neighborhoods.

For our sovereign borders I advocate barbed wire over fencing and after 9/11, shoot on sight orders for criminal invaders, criminals all - al Qaeda some.

It is two generations late, but we must round up this criminal element and deport them ASAP so our economy can stop the distortions in labor pricing and supply.

[Alberta's Child]

I don't know how you would measure a nation's standard of living, but the following information from www.worldfactsandfigures.com offers a comparison of per-capita GDP (which I admit is not necessarily an accurate measure of a nation's standard of living).

1. Luxembourg $ 44,000
2. United States $ 37,600
3. Bermuda $ 35,200
4. Cayman Islands $ 35,000
5. San Marino $ 34,600
6. Norway $ 31,800
7. Switzerland $ 31,700
8. Ireland $ 30,500
9. Canada $ 29,400
10. Belgium $ 29,000
11. Denmark $ 29,000
12. Aruba $ 28,000
13. Japan $ 28,000
14. Austria $ 27,700
15. Australia $ 27,000
16. Monaco $ 27,000
17. Netherlands $ 26,900
18. Germany $ 26,600
19. Finland $ 26,200
20. Hong Kong $ 26,000

If you were to measure a nation's standard of living by the quantity of products and services its citizens enjoy relative to the citizens of other nations, I would venture to guess that the U.S. would be at the top of this list by a very wide margin. Even many people living at the poverty line in this country own things like cars, home electronics, satellite dishes, computers, etc. in numbers that exceed most of the world's countries.

Japan remains an export economy, by the way.

Which makes sense if their largest customer is the United States (or any other country above them on the list I provided). What makes this a little fuzzy is the way exports/imports may be tallied in Japan and the United States. A Toyota that is manufactured in Ohio and sold in California may be counted as a Japanese "export" even though it was built by U.S. labor and never left the United States.

[jgrubbs]

WASHINGTON (AP) - Millions of illegal migrant farmers, hotel maids and others working in the shadows of American society would be granted legal status and freed from the threat of deportation under an election-year proposal President Bush wants Congress to approve.

Bush called Mexican President Vicente Fox to brief him Wednesday morning in advance of Bush's speech later in the day at the White House.

"There are some jobs in this country, in our growing economy, that Americans are not filling," White House press secretary Scott McClellan said. "That presents an opportunity for workers from abroad who want to work."

http://apnews.myway.com/article/20040107/D7VU379O2.html

[jgrubbs]

"By dangling the prospect of legal status to some 8 million illegal immigrants now estimated to be in this country, about half of them Mexican, Bush was granting a top priority of the business community while making his most aggressive move yet to court Hispanic voters - the nation's fastest-growing electoral bloc."

We must oppose bilingual ballots. We need to insist that those who wish to take part in the electoral process and governance of this nation be required to read and comprehend basic English as a precondition of citizenship.

[antaresequity]

I got out of the business because in order to compete you had to break the law...

I have no interest in that....

[antaresequity]

Again, would you tell us all how many Illegaliens you've employed? It's employers like you who have no idea nor care what you're doing to your employees

Sure thing...go ahead and bid against competition that uses illegals....

Let me know how it turns out

I got out of the construction business for many reasons...one was that in order to compete...you had to break the law...I said screw that

Dont give me your pie in the sky idealism...the American consumers vote with their bucks...I got burned out of so many contracts by guys who didnt pay comp, paid under the table etc etc etc...

Now go ahead and tell me Its guys like me that are ruining the economy...what a joke....

Americans vote with their bucks

[azhenfud]

That's commendable, FWIW.
It's sad our government is reduced to that which had rather place business owners/operators in the position of profits over principles than demonstrate the testicular fortitude to enforce the laws they've already enacted.
Regards,
Az

[antaresequity]

Ya...my own experience...None of the guys I hired ever sucked off the govmint tit...and they work circles around the high school and college kids who go running to mommy when there first blister busts... As to "Cheap" labor...there is a bit of market fundamental you are ignoring...

Labor is never 'cheap' nor is it 'expensive'...it just is. If person A will do the job that person B is doing for a buck less an hour...how in the world does that equate to being 'cheap'?

Less expensive yes...but not cheap.

I suppose when you have a choice to buy an item on sale from store B or pay full price for the same item at store A, you go to store A and pay full price?

Simple market forces at work. Just like the American consumers that are faced with a choice when selecting a contractor to put in a new swimming pool. They will take the lower price 9 times out 10.

Don't blame me buddy...blame yourself and your neighbor.Please drop me a line when you run out and hire a Union Laborer for 40 bucks a smack to dig out your juniper bushes.

And like I said before, I got out, because the present situation sucks, and I am not interested in breaking the law, and less interested in getting busted.