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To: Windsong
On the other hand, maybe God shouldnt have let the ba$tard in in thr FIRST place. Would you let a known pedophile into your living room to play with your little girl?

Adam was the agent, not the angels, and not God. Adam was to protect her. Adam let Satan deceive her. Adam allowed Satan to go forward. He didn't challenge him, or contradict him. He didn't love his wife. He didn't protect her.

Look, God can't do anything here unless He has a human to agree with Him to allow it. That's the way He set it up, and such is the nature of His authority. He gave it completely to man, and He won't go back on His Word.

I used to ask, "why didn't He just make another man after Adam rebelled?" Here's the answer: Genesis 2:1  ¶Thus the heavens and the earth were finished, and all the host of them. 2  And on the seventh day God ended his work which he had made; and he rested on the seventh day from all his work which he had made.

God completed His creation. That was it. There was no more. His authority here was now subject totally to the will of man. He can communicate with us, and He certainly can persuade us, but He cannot force us by His power. Neither can Satan, BTW. We are the final spiritual authority here.

Again, free will is the answer to your logic. You are assuming an extreme Calvinist approach, but it's incorrect. Sadly, much of the church believes this crap too. Check this link for more insight-- it's pretty revealing.

http://www.pfrs.org/calvinism/calvin09.html

Bottom line is this. You are projecting a victim mentality on humanity. We aren't innocent in this. That's why we can all share responsibility in the death of Jesus.

That's why the ADL is so upset with Mel Gibson, they feel the guilt His death, except they don't realize it's the rest of humanity too. That's why it's 'intolerant' or 'hateful' to mention Jesus anymore. By extension, the Gospel accuses man of murdering God. (If you want to find the mystical root, Adam killed Jesus in the garden. We were all in Adam at the time.) That's what makes the Gospel so elementally strong. At the same time, it reveals our devastation and our redemption, it condemns us and offers us greatness. Blaming God is a deception. He's the One who gave us a way out.

50 posted on 01/05/2004 4:20:02 AM PST by ovrtaxt (You got an extra Communist Manifesto? I'm like totally out of toilet paper.)
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To: ovrtaxt
"Adam was the agent, not the angels, and not God. Adam was to protect her. Adam let Satan deceive her. Adam allowed Satan to go forward. He didn't challenge him, or contradict him. He didn't love his wife. He didn't protect her."

So its all the eeeeevil male's fault eh? Isn't that stretching it a bit? Genesis never said that he didn't love her. The way I interpreted it, I saw that Satan went to her bc he knew he couldn't "get" to Adam the way he could Eve. Emotion has always been the achilles heel of women. Same then, same now.

"God can't do anything here unless He has a human to agree with Him to allow it."

Well that philosophy certainly didn't work with Christ, whom at one point asked NOT to go the cross (the prayer in the garden..take this cup, etc etc).

Im not a Calvinist..I just think that someone who hails himself as a "father" should take the responsibilities of a father..and accountability. God made a mistake..he let the drivel in knowing full well what would happen..and didn't send in any advance warning whatsoever so that he could prepare himself. That is not only irresponsible, its appallingly lax and unloving. If you knew that 9/11 was going to occur in 2000, would you not bear some responsibilty if you didn't alert the authorities? Satan had already been drummed out of Heaven..so where is Gabriel? Or Michael? Or any of the other angels with all of these "special" powers?

Sipping tea in the celestial gazebo?

Puh-lease.

53 posted on 01/05/2004 12:57:06 PM PST by Windsong
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To: ovrtaxt
bump
54 posted on 01/05/2004 5:13:10 PM PST by garybob (More sweat in training, less blood in combat.)
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