Replies

"Classical" Neanderthals had MUCH heavier bones and muscle attachments than modern man. Although stockier and of shorter stature, they were far tougher, physically,than we are.

The thrust of this article, and the argument under discussion, is whether or not "Modern Man" evolved independently in Europe, Asia and Africa, or he developed in Africa and moved into Eurasia, displacing the earlier Hominin populations there.

This particular article seems to imply that there was a degree of intermixing between early modern man and Neanderthal man in parts of Europe.

I would agree, if you took a late Neanderthal, gave him a bath, sahve and haircut and put him in a business suit, he would probably look just like a very strong modern man with rough features and in a city like New York would probably not stand out at all.

Yes, there are a few knuckledraggers in NYC.

Have they aquired sufficient DNA strands from Neanderthal to determine the claims made in this article? Are they a seperate species? Can this be proven without DNA?

Are (were) they as seperate from us as a chimp is to an orang? I HAVE to know the answere to these questions.

"Classical" Neanderthals had MUCH heavier bones and muscle attachments than modern man. Although stockier and of shorter stature, they were far tougher, physically,than we are.

Images I've seen simply do not show that much difference between neanderthal and modern skeletons other than height. At least one article on the web describes the neanderthal as a 5'6" endomorph marginally different in build from modern people living in cold climates. That's basically a 5 foot six eskimo. How much of a chance would you give a five foot six eskimo in the ring with Rocky Marciano?

This particular article seems to imply that there was a degree of intermixing between early modern man and Neanderthal man in parts of Europe.

That contradicts everything I've read. One typical article describes modern man and neanderthals as last sharing a common ancestor about half a million years ago. Articles I've read describe neanderthal DNA as ape-like and not related to ours at all.

Although stockier and of shorter stature, they were far tougher, physically,than we are.

In addition to the well-known brow ridge (which early Homo sapiens had and some people still show), Neanderthals had a low-crowned brain case extending in a "bun" in the back. They had bell-shaped rib cages which together with short lower vertebrae and wide hips meant they had almost no "waist" area. That is, their rib cages hung low over their hips, reducing flexibility but giving them better armor against the kind of "gut wound" that was inevitably fatal until sometime in the 20th century. They also had rather funny upper-arm/lower arm and upper-leg/lower leg ratios. (The lower parts of the limbs were short, outside the range of modern variation.)

You're right that they were "built tough." They show the same pattern of injuries as veteran rodeo cowboys: lots of healed breaks. In hunting big animals, they apparently didn't use the kind of weapons you throw or shoot from a distance.