COMING TO AMERICA
Social Security for Mexicans closer to reality
U.S. discussing plan to allow millions of immigrants to collect benefits
Posted on 12/11/2003 7:55:33 PM PST by VU4G10
The prospect of millions of Mexicans receiving United States Social Security checks is moving closer to reality.
The Gannett News Service reports U.S. and Mexican officials are discussing a "totalization" agreement that would transfer hundreds of millions of dollars in payments south of the border. The plan would allow documented and undocumented immigrants to return home but still collect U.S. benefits.
WorldNetDaily reported the idea to merge both countries' Social Security systems was pushed late last year by Mexican President Vincente Fox as payback from President George W. Bush for failing to secure major new immigration reforms beneficial to Mexico City.
"When the legalization talks began going nowhere, the Mexicans began focusing on this," Maria Blanco, national senior counsel for the Mexican American Legal Defense and Educational Fund, told the Washington Post.
Excerpts from a U.S. Social Security Administration memo dated December 2002 said the agreement "is expected to move forward at an accelerated pace."
The pact is the latest and largest attempt by Washington and Mexico City to ensure that people from one country working in another aren't taxed twice for Social Security benefits. In the first year alone, the agreement is expected to trigger 37,000 claims from Mexicans working in the U.S. legally who paid Social Security taxes but haven't been able to claim their checks, said the memo, prepared by Ted Girdner, the Social Security Administration's assistant associate commissioner for international operations.
Supporters say the proposal would improve the daily lives of Mexican citizens, many of whom are still trapped in poverty a decade after the North American Free Trade Agreement promised prosperity to the nation's 103.4 million people.
"Let's be honest, there are millions of Mexican immigrants contributing to the Social Security system and the U.S. economy," Katherine Culliton, an attorney with the Washington, D.C., office of the Mexican American Legal Defense and Education Fund, told Gannett. "It's only fair they get back a benefit they deserve that will keep them from dying in poverty."
Critics, as well as some on the Bush administration economic team, worry that adding more beneficiaries would burden an already ailing system, just as American baby boomers begin to retire.
Currently, around 94,000 beneficiaries living abroad have been brought into the U.S. system under the auspices of about 20 international treaties designed to help Americans sent abroad by their employers signed since 1977. The accords are mostly with European countries, but also include Canada and South Korea.
Of the $408 billion distributed in Social Security benefits in 2001, according to Gannett, the federal government paid $173 million to about 89,000 foreigners living abroad.
Opponents contend the number of Mexican beneficiaries added to the fold would dwarf the total numbers from the 20 other countries. One estimate puts the number of Mexicans coming into the system at around 164,000 in the first five years.
Social Security Administration officials estimate about 50,000 Mexicans would collect $78 million in the first year of a U.S.-Mexican agreement. By 2050, the number is predicted to swell to 300,000 Mexicans collecting $650 million in benefits a year.
But that number doesn't include the potentially eligible, undocumented Mexican immigrants – numbering about 5 million, according to federal estimates – a recent General Accounting Office report pointed out.
Accounting for illegals, the agreement could cost U.S. taxpayers $750 million within five years of implementation.
Steven A. Camarota, director of research at the Center for Immigration Studies, says if Mexicans receive the $8,100 in benefits that Mexican-born retirees in the U.S. currently get, the total expenditure for the program will easily surpass $1 billion annually.
Beyond the cost, Republican lawmakers worry the proposal will fuel further illegal immigration.
"Talk about an incentive for illegal immigration," Gannett quotes Rep. Ron Paul, R-Texas, as saying. "How many more would break the law to come to this country if promised U.S. government paychecks for life?"
Any "totalization" agreement ultimately reached must be approved by Congress.
By the way, the topic line is part of the article.
By the way, the topic line is part of the article.
Note the 'millions' word is used there too.
Good job using the " "'s around voluntarily.
But is it "your" money what you put in?
I don't think the Government thinks so.
That's to be expected, the scary thing is that most of the people on this thread thinks that it is "our" money...collectively.
Billy...
Is this you?
I thought you had a problem with "is", not "if".
Consider the source.
It's yellow jopurnalism.
The Chair recognizes the gentlewoman from Tennessee, Ms. Blackburn, for 5 minutes.
Mrs. BLACKBURN. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
Ms. Bovbjerg, I want to stay right with that train of thought right there. So what I am understanding from you is that illegal immigrants and their families, their survivors, their dependents could be eligible or a family of someone who worked illegally in this country could be eligible for Social Security benefits under the totalization agreement in part because it is silent on the condition of being here legally or illegally?
Ms. BOVBJERG. You are required under the law from the Welfare Reform Act of '96 to be legally present to get benefits here. How you earn those benefits is not relevant to the Social Security Administration's work. If you earned them legally or illegally and you are legally present, you will be paid those benefits. If you are not legally present, you can get them if you are a Mexican citizen in Mexico.
Mrs. BLACKBURN. In Mexico.
Ms. BOVBJERG. Yes. But your family—under current law it is difficult for your family to do that, and a provision that is in current law is waived in the totalization agreements generally.
Mrs. BLACKBURN. Okay, but what you are saying is the family could be there in Mexico, the person could have worked here, have been an illegal immigrant here and still draw those benefits?
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Ms. BOVBJERG. Under totalization.
Mrs. BLACKBURN. Under totalization. So when you consider this and consider the 5 million undocumented workers that you all estimate are here in the U.S. And you are looking at Social Security and survivor benefits and widow benefits and then these have to be included in your compilation, your cost estimate, would you please give me what you think is a top range of a cost estimate for this?
Ms. BOVBJERG. I wish I could. We looked at the actuaries' estimates because we know that they are in the best position to provide this kind of information and we felt that, given other things, we knew the estimates could be on the low end of the range. I think what we were really looking for is what might the range be and how really could we think about this apparent disconnect between the number of people assumed in the estimate and the number of people that the former INS estimated in the year 2000. I think that is the conversation and that is the kind of analysis that would be helpful in thinking about a totalization agreement with Mexico.
I was stating a posibility, not a fact, but you are to stubborn to admit that.
Well if it is your money, go ask to get your money back. You will find that is ain't your money at all. At least not after the gubbermit gets their hands on it.
I'll get it back the moment I retire, and regardless of where I chose to live.
By the way, just because someone stole something from you and you can't get back, it does not stop belonging to you.
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