[jocon307]

Bump to read later.

[Jeff Head]

It desparetly needs a reformer.

Bu tthey are hoping for a real Mahdi.

If the get the latter, IMHO, this is the type of a thing that will happen.

Some feel Bin Laden is a potential Mahdi of sorts (albeit I disagree completely with this, he's far too much a maveric to unite them all). But look what he's been able to stir up.

[Rebelbase]

This was part of a discussion my dad and I had over Thanksgiving.

He claims the Muslims had their "Luther" and killed him.

[Kenton]

Well, until they decide, can we bring back Torquemada?

[TheSpottedOwl]

What Islam needs is a Pope.

Lol, what Islam needs are dedicated insurgents, who will attack Islam from within. Just like they did to the Catholic religion.

[muawiyah]

Absolutely amazing to wake up in the morning to a debate which suggests that "infallibility" in the hands of an individual is not possible while "infallibility" in the hands of a different individual is not only possible but required.

Waaaaaaaaahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Look, Islam needs to do nothing more than go back to it's roots and rediscover (publicly) that for the first 300 years most Moslems prayed in Christian churches! Many of the more "primitive" groups also need to enlighten themselves and observe that the Koran has both sacred and secular sections. Then there are a bunch of hadiths that need to be tossed in the trashcan since the "evidence" and "claims" behind them are patently without foundation.

Sharia law (which didn't get locked in place until about the time of the Crusades) also needs a good shaking down. At the moment the Imams claim Sharia Law is based on God's Law as found in the hadiths and the Koran. Obviously it's not and these guys have got to face up to that fact or it's going to be just one thing after another for an indefinite period.

[B.O. Plenty]

"Does Islam Need a Luther or a Pope?".....naaaaaaaaa...it just needs to disappear from the face of the Earth.

[ALASKA]

Does Islam Need a Luther or a Pope?

What Islam needs is a Jim Jones.

[Mercat]

ping

[joesnuffy]

Neither...because Islam springs from a false premise...
Jesus is not God the Son there is no God the Father God the Holy Spirit
The source of Islam is satan...
Those who love death hate God
You cant "reform" a bituminous pit into an artesian well of fresh water
imo

[Savage Beast]

"Does Islam Need a Luther or a Pope?"

Neither. It needs Christian missionaries--lots of them and highly dedicated.

[Redbob]

Why a Luther or a Pope, when they have so many many Stalins and Hitlers?

[A. Pole]

The fact of the matter is that those aspects of Islam that seem to put it unalterably at odds with the modern world are, for the most part, precisely those that it shares in common with Protestantism; and that those features of modern Western civilization most crucial to the maintenance of liberty and scientific reason owe far more to the Catholic Church than they do to Luther and Calvin.

Very interesting text!

[steve-b]

and (especially where the institution or practice is very ancient and widespread) the change can never be more than piecemeal, a tinkering around the edges that leaves the core of the practice or institution intact

If this were to be accepted as a generally valid principle, then abolitionism would have been rejected in favor of merely requiring slaveowners to provide improved working conditions and less severe discipline.

[Sabertooth]

Does Islam Need a Luther or a Pope?

That's like asking if a crazy dog would be smarter if it got a new tail.

Islam's head will always be Mohammed. So long as Mohammed was a liar, a conqueror, a murderer, an enslaver, and a pedophile who converted at swordpoint, the problems of Islam will not be solved.

[ahumblefan]

The modern Catholic Church is what it is because of Protestantism. The Catholic Church was completely reorganized several hundred years ago during the Council of Trent because of the Reformation. Doctrines such as Papal infallibility and the supremecy of traditional Catholic teachings over the Bible's authority date from that period. I love my Catholic brothers, but theirs is a relatively recent version of Christianity compared to much of Protestantism. They speak from four hundred years of tradition. Bible believing Christians speak from nearly two thousand years of wisdom, experience and knowledge.

[dyed_in_the_wool]

Neither.
It needs a John Locke and a Glorious Revolution.

[doug from upland]

This is what is needed --

[Snuffington]

Pinging to an article of orcish interest.

[lilylangtree]

Yep, islamics definitely need reforming. Hope it comes in the form of a Jasper or Jaspina!