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State firefighters rejected air drop request for Cedar Fire because of night regulations
SFGate.com ^
| October 30, 2003
| JUSTIN PRITCHARD
Posted on 10/31/2003 5:39:52 AM PST by Moiraine
Edited on 04/13/2004 2:44:38 AM PDT by Jim Robinson.
[history]
The first helicopter pilot to see the patch of flames that would become the catastrophic Cedar Fire radioed for aerial water drops, but state firefighters rejected his request because it came minutes after such flights had been grounded for the night.
(Excerpt) Read more at sfgate.com ...
TOPICS: News/Current Events
KEYWORDS: cedarfire; firefighters
1
posted on
10/31/2003 5:39:53 AM PST
by
Moiraine
To: Moiraine
I was near the flight path of those big tankers when I lived in California.Take off is loud ,low and slow.
2
posted on
10/31/2003 5:47:23 AM PST
by
MEG33
To: Moiraine
There always seems to be some idiot who loves policy to the point that it turns the routine into tragedy. I'm reminded of the Park Superintendent who lit a controlled burn (according to policy - although there were 50 mph winds at the top of the ridge) and then tried to put it out when it got a bit bigger than he liked, without calling in help. It ended up burning 50,000 acres in and around Los Alamos NM (400 homes). He was allowed to retire because he had "followed policy."
3
posted on
10/31/2003 5:47:24 AM PST
by
Tijeras_Slim
(SSDD - Same S#it Different Democrat)
To: Moiraine
Yeah, right! Sounds like a Davis Payback and Union Issue combined.
4
posted on
10/31/2003 5:47:24 AM PST
by
Redleg Duke
(Stir the pot...don't let anything settle to the bottom where the lawyers can feed off of it!)
To: Moiraine
There always seems to be some idiot who loves policy to the point that it turns the routine into tragedy. I'm reminded of the Park Superintendent who lit a controlled burn (according to policy - although there were 50 mph winds at the top of the ridge) and then tried to put it out when it got a bit bigger than he liked, without calling in help. It ended up burning 50,000 acres in and around Los Alamos NM (400 homes). He was allowed to retire because he had "followed policy."
5
posted on
10/31/2003 5:47:38 AM PST
by
Tijeras_Slim
(SSDD - Same S#it Different Democrat)
To: Moiraine
The CDF murdered those fire victims. They are guilty of criminal bureaucratic negligence.
6
posted on
10/31/2003 5:52:14 AM PST
by
Jimbaugh
(They will not get away with this. Developing . . . . .)
To: Tijeras_Slim
Jeez... Is it just me or is FR acting strange this AM?
7
posted on
10/31/2003 5:52:52 AM PST
by
Tijeras_Slim
(SSDD - Same S#it Different Democrat)
To: Moiraine
A perfect example of not letting the professionals do their business and instead giving control to petty bureaucrats.
To: Moiraine
I guess I was unaware that planes are unable to fly safely at night.
9
posted on
10/31/2003 6:18:55 AM PST
by
Lost Highway
(There's no stopping the cretins from hoppin.)
To: Tijeras_Slim
Perhaps Serabia just had a hot date that evening.
10
posted on
10/31/2003 6:27:17 AM PST
by
expatpat
To: Moiraine
The policies themselves are probably in place for a good reason--low-level firebombing, at night, in mountainous terrain, is incredibly dangerous, maybe to the point of foolhardiness. But they definitely need to add some wiggle room to those policies, some pilot discretion if nothing else.
Hindsight is always 20/20.
}:-)4
11
posted on
10/31/2003 7:19:31 AM PST
by
Moose4
(What America needs is less "law" and more common sense.)
To: Lost Highway
I guess I was unaware that planes are unable to fly safely at night. When you're flying really close to the ground it's helpful to be able to see the ground.
To: Moose4
But they definitely need to add some wiggle room to those policies, some pilot discretion if nothing else.A good suggestion but ineffective unless these pilots are legally absolved of all responsibilty while exercising their discretion.
Therein lies the basis for the strict rules. Litigation under the good Samaritan liability concept. LA County has a more defensable position against the litigation that will certainly follow the death of that unfortunate sole than had they authorized the twilight air drop.
As silly as it sounds, at least in this example, tort reform in California would save lives.
To: Jimbaugh
guess where their interest is...
CDF Director BioExecutive Staff Bios
Andrea E. Tuttle
Director - California Department of Forestry and Fire Protection
 Andrea E. Tuttle |
Andrea Tuttle was appointed Director of the California Department of Forestry and Fire Protection by Governor Gray Davis in March 1999. Prior to her appointment, she served as a member of the California Coastal Commission, an appointment made by now Lieutenant Governor Cruz Bustamante. Andrea was lead consultant in the firm she founded, Andrea Tuttle & Associates, Natural Resource Policy and Planning.
Andrea has brought to CDF an extensive background in environmental conservation and land-use planning. Her active involvement in environmental protection over a 25 year period has earned her the respect of the environmental community enviroNazi and state leaders.
Early in Andrea's career she was appointed as a member of the Planning Commission for the City of Arcata. That was followed by an appointment in 1976, by then Governor Jerry Brown, to the California Regional Water Quality Control Board-Northcoast Region. In 1987 she filled the position of principal consultant to state Senator Barry Keene for the Senate-Select Committee on Forest Resources. As part of Senator Keene's staff, Andrea participated in forestry negotiations including the much-publicized attempts at forest practice reform known as the Sierra Accord, California Accord and Grand Accord. In 1998 she became a member of the Board of Directors for the Planning and Conservation League.
A strong interest in international sustainable development and resource management, including the effects of global warming has taken Andrea to much of southeast Asia, Central and South America, the Mediterranean and former Balkans, Egypt, and western Russia.
As lead consultant of Andrea Tuttle & Associates, she traveled to Malaysia and Chile to work on environmental conservation. Working in cooperation with the Peninsular and Sabah Forestry Departments in Malaysia and the German Agency for Technical Cooperation (GTZ) she assisted in developing management practices to mitigate the impacts of logging, a 99-year model timber agreement for sustainable forest management, and options for implementing environmental impact assessment requirements for logging. In Chile, Andrea presented the principles and practices of coastal zone management at the request of the Chilean Secretary of the Navy.
Andrea's main focus, however, has been California. A longtime resident of Humboldt County, with a Ph.D. in Environmental Planning and a bachelor's degree in Biological Sciences from UC Berkeley, and a masters degree in Zoology (Marine ecology) from the University of Washington, she has taught, researched and written about natural resource management in this State.
She has worked with the California State Board of Forestry and Fire Protection on a number of projects throughout the years beginning with the Best Management Practices Advisory Committee in the late 1970s. In 1992, Andrea assisted the Board in the sensitive watershed rulemaking process. In 1993 she acted as a consultant to the Board developing methods for monitoring the implementation and effectiveness of Forest Practice Rules for the protection of water quality, fishery and riparian resources.
As CDF Director Andrea Tuttle plays a leading role in Governor Gray Davis' Administration. She oversees the largest multi-purpose fire protection agency of its type in the world. The Department has an annual budget of almost $500 million, nearly 4,000 permanent employees, and an average of 1,500 seasonal fire fighting personnel during fire season. CDF provides wildland fire protection to 33 million acres of forest, range and watershed lands, most of which is private property. In addition, Department personnel and equipment respond to over 250,000 non-fire emergencies each year. CDF also enforces the State's Forest Practice Act with a team of foresters, wildlife biologists, hydrologists and other resource specialists, supports urban forestry programs, implements vegetation management to reduce fire hazards and restore native habitats, manages the 50,200 acre Jackson Demonstration State Forest and encourages sustainable forest management of the working landscape - programs that all strive to maintain California's natural resources and quality of life.
14
posted on
10/31/2003 8:55:08 AM PST
by
Toidylop
To: Moiraine
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