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Gadget Prevents Plane Seats From Reclining
AP via Excite News ^ | Oct 24, 2:00 PM (ET) | BRAD FOSS

Posted on 10/24/2003 1:35:02 PM PDT by leadpencil1

WASHINGTON (AP) - Every cramped air traveler may have the right to lean his seat back, but Ira Goldman sees airplane justice from another perspective - that of the person behind - and he's found a way to even the score.

Goldman invented the Knee Defender, a beeper-sized block of plastic that lets passengers prevent the seat in front of them from reclining.

The gadget, which went on sale about a month ago on the Internet for $10, has sparked heated debate in online chat rooms, and aviation officials worry about the disagreements that will be generated at 30,000 feet.

Alison Duquette, a spokeswoman for the Federal Aviation Administration, said the product violates no FAA regulations, so it would be up to individual airlines to prohibit it.

Northwest Airlines (NWB) said it will ban the Knee Defender from all flights. Other carriers, such as American Airlines and Delta Air Lines, acknowledged concerns about safety - not to mention the comfort of passengers who want to recline - but are still figuring out what to do.

The safety concerns stem from the design, because the Knee Defender works only when the tray table is down. The hard plastic block, which has an inch-wide groove down the middle, fits around the arm of a tray table and acts as a barrier to the seat's backward movement.

"We have tested this product on several seat types and find that when installed, should someone try to force the seat to recline, the tray table assembly can break," said Mary Stanik, a Northwest spokeswoman. "If the seat is damaged, including the tray table, in flight, it may adversely affect passenger evacuation in the event of an emergency."

Goldman said he would stop selling the product if the airlines prove it unsafe, but so far he's unmoved by their arguments. The 50-year-old Washington, D.C., resident, who's 6-foot-4, said he didn't invent Knee Defender so fliers would be able to "hog scarce space," but rather for the physical well-being of tall travelers like himself.

"If I hadn't been bashed in the knees over and over again, this wouldn't have been invented," said Goldman, who estimated that nearly 1,000 Knee Defenders have been ordered. At the very least, he said the device could be a useful "early warning system" for long-legged fliers or people using laptops, enabling them to ask the passenger in front not to recline.

"Be polite to fellow passengers," says a sticker affixed to each Knee Defender.

Kevin Gross of San Francisco, who ordered a Knee Defender but hasn't yet used it, said he would immediately remove the device if asked to by a passenger or flight attendant. But Gross is betting it'll go undetected in most cases, since travelers will just assume the seat is busted and not make a fuss.

Don't count on 50-year-old Dan Hammer of White Plains, N.Y., to be so docile.

"If I saw somebody that put the Knee Defender on the seat behind me so that I can't go back, I'll be very upset," Hammer said.

That's just the kind of high dudgeon that worries Dawn Deeks, a spokeswoman for the Association of Flight Attendants.

After all, flight attendants already often ask passengers not to lean back too far, and they would be the ones to police any disputes.

To Deeks, the Knee Defender is "an insensitive knee-jerk reaction to insensitive people" that would only inflame tempers.


TOPICS: Culture/Society
KEYWORDS: airlines; invention
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To: Lazamataz

81 posted on 10/24/2003 2:36:07 PM PDT by Rebelbase
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To: LurkedLongEnough
ping
82 posted on 10/24/2003 2:36:08 PM PDT by leadpencil1 (Kill your television)
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To: Rebelbase
PRECIOUS!!! MY darling dog. OOOOOOO good little doggie. Stop nibbling on the human skin, my Precious. I have a suit to make.
83 posted on 10/24/2003 2:38:20 PM PDT by Lazamataz (I am the extended middle finger in the fist of life.)
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To: alaskanfan
What is interesting to me is the sheer amount of hostility that a lot of airline-travel topics arouse these days. I follow several travel coumns, and the angry tone is unmistakable. I think the mindless drones at the TSA have contributed mightily to this problem, as well as the often-rude gate agents and flight attendants.

Flying is pretty much the same as riding a Greyhound bus these days- and that's not meant as a compliment to the airlines.

84 posted on 10/24/2003 2:39:23 PM PDT by RANGERAIRBORNE ("De gustibus non disputandem est")
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To: RANGERAIRBORNE
I don't fault the airlines for trying to make a dollar. In business you do what you have to to be competitive.

I do blame my fellow travelers, who seem to have no cosideration for their fellow man.

85 posted on 10/24/2003 2:49:50 PM PDT by alaskanfan
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To: alaskanfan
cosideration

consideration

sorry!

86 posted on 10/24/2003 2:52:36 PM PDT by alaskanfan
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To: The KG9 Kid
I was at a bible study, and one member mentioned that he and 4 others had to travel.

It was cheaper for the 5 of them to charter a business jet, and then be able to fly directly to the closer regional airport. He said by doing that, would also save them about 5 hours of extra travel time.
87 posted on 10/24/2003 2:53:45 PM PDT by Johnny Gage (Have you ever imagined a world without hypothetical situations?)
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To: leadpencil1
Folks who use such a gadget deserve a lousy airlines meal squished into their faces.
88 posted on 10/24/2003 2:56:30 PM PDT by k2blader (Haruspex, beware.)
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To: AxelPaulsenJr
"You have been fortunate so far. However I think your behavior is very rude."

As opposed to leaning back into the lap of the person behind you and hogging part of what little room exists on the plane? I fly a lot and I work a lot on planes (to avoid sucking up additional time at home) and I hate it when people recline. I ask people not to recline their seats and some get testy about it. But you know what, I didn't pay good money to have the top of someone else's seat stuck under my nose for 2 hours. And I don't recline my seat even when I'm sleeping because I try to treat others as I would like to be treated.

Sign me up for the product.

89 posted on 10/24/2003 3:01:08 PM PDT by hometoroost
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To: AxelPaulsenJr
The problem with the front row seat is that there is no seat in front of you to put your bag under. Makes it hard to get to things to work on.
90 posted on 10/24/2003 3:03:03 PM PDT by hometoroost
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To: Lazamataz
I wouldn't praise Allah when I'm killing people.

Yeah. That would be crazy...

91 posted on 10/24/2003 3:06:37 PM PDT by null and void
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To: dirtboy
I'm inclined to dislike this device (sorry...) - but while 5'7", I can understand the plight. It is a tight enough fit for me!

I used to have a co-worker who was 6' 8" with bad knees. On one full flight, his knees were in the back of the seat & his feet dangling off the floor (very fat person either side).

After that, he told our boss to either fund his travel 1st class, or he wouldn't go. A civilian (I'm military - no one would care if I said that), he got his wish.
92 posted on 10/24/2003 3:10:26 PM PDT by Mr Rogers
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To: RANGERAIRBORNE
"What is interesting to me is the sheer amount of hostility that a lot of airline-travel topics arouse these days. I follow several travel coumns, and the angry tone is unmistakable. I think the mindless drones at the TSA have contributed mightily to this problem, as well as the often-rude gate agents and flight attendants. Flying is pretty much the same as riding a Greyhound bus these days- and that's not meant as a compliment to the airlines.

The TSA folks (actually the process itself) have added to the tension level. The worst part is they really believe they are making a difference. With their failure rate, the added measures don't make us any safer - just lighter in the wallet, more pressed for time, and a little more frazzled.

The guy with the box cutters and bleach proved what I have been telling every TSA employee that engages me in conversation - you're just here to make the politicians feel like they have done something in the war on terrorism and to add another few thousand jobs to the government payroll.

93 posted on 10/24/2003 3:13:26 PM PDT by hometoroost
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To: dirtboy
Yep, I'm a little over 6'7" and 255 lbs. I always tell the ticket agent that I had requested a emergency row seat. I tell them point blank that I physically cannot fit in other rows, etc. etc... 50% of the time they upgrade me to business or 1st class......of course, I'm always the picture of the courteous traveler and I always wear my boots and stetson.......
94 posted on 10/24/2003 3:14:09 PM PDT by OregonRancher
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To: newgeezer
I wish I had a private business jet. :(
95 posted on 10/24/2003 3:16:54 PM PDT by The KG9 Kid (Semper Fi)
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To: OregonRancher; leadpencil1
I'm a little over 6'7" and 255 lbs.

Dear Lord, don't ever book a domestic coach flight on British Airways. I'm only 6' and Gulliver had more freedom of movement whilest tied up in Liliput.

96 posted on 10/24/2003 3:28:28 PM PDT by LTCJ (Killing threads singlehandedly since June 2001)
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To: leadpencil1
I'm 5'0" and *I* am miserable in airline seats. I don't see how anyone taller can stand to fly.

The airlines ought to just remove all the seats and put in poles to hang on to. Fly standing. It'd be more comfortable and probably safer....

I don't understand how a flamewar could erupt over this. Geez, people, you need an election BAD.
97 posted on 10/24/2003 3:34:04 PM PDT by ChemistCat (Hang in there, Terri. Absorb. Take in. Live. Heal.)
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To: leadpencil1
I think I'll copy this thread to the CEO's of the major airlines for customer feedback purposes.

American Airlines removed rows of seats in economy class to increase leg room. Now, on certain flights, there are putting them back. Why? Because most travellers choose the lowest priced seat and will not pay more for comfort. This is free enterprice in action.

98 posted on 10/24/2003 3:55:08 PM PDT by Doe Eyes
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To: leadpencil1
This is what's causing all the ruckus around here:


99 posted on 10/24/2003 3:58:41 PM PDT by raybbr
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To: ChemistCat
The airlines ought to just remove all the seats and put in poles to hang on to. Fly standing. It'd be more comfortable and probably safer....

One would hope it'd be cheaper too!

But a question arises:

What would be the official "pole space" size? 4 square feet? Would lean-challenged people have to pay more?

100 posted on 10/24/2003 4:00:53 PM PDT by k2blader (Haruspex, beware.)
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