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Postwar Civilian Deaths in Baghdad Probed
Yahoo! News ^ | Mon Oct 20 | KAREN MATTHEWS

Posted on 10/21/2003 4:13:43 AM PDT by Core_Conservative

NEW YORK - A human rights organization says it has confirmed 20 civilian deaths under questionable circumstances in Baghdad since May 1, when President Bush (news - web sites) declared an end to major combat operations in Iraq (news - web sites), and has received credible reports of dozens more.

AP Photo

Related Links • Post-war Civilian Deaths in Baghdad (Human Rights Watch)

In a report released late Monday, Human Rights Watch also accused the U.S. military of failing to conduct proper investigations into excessive or indiscriminate use of force in the Iraqi capital.

"It's a tragedy that U.S. soldiers have killed so many civilians in Baghdad," said Joe Stork, acting executive director of the Middle East and North Africa division of the New York-based group, which monitors human rights abuses around the world.

"But it's really incredible that the U.S. military does not even count these deaths," Stork said. "Any time U.S. forces kill an Iraqi civilian in questionable circumstances, they should investigate the incident."

Lt. Col. George Krivo, a spokesman for the U.S. command in Baghdad, said Monday that he had not seen the report, but added that "we do take investigations very seriously."

Human Rights Watch said it was able to confirm 20 civilian deaths caused by U.S. forces in Iraq's capital between May 1 and Sept. 30, based on interviews with witnesses and victims' relatives. The organization also said it received "credible reports" that U.S. forces killed another 74 civilians under questionable circumstances during the five-month period.

The organization recommended better language and cultural training, as well as more accountability for soldiers who now operate "with virtual impunity in Iraq."

In compiling its report, Human Rights Watch said it conducted more than 60 interviews, reviewed police records and media accounts, and collected information from the military and human rights groups.

As of Oct. 1, the organization said, U.S. forces had acknowledged completing five investigations above the division level into alleged unlawful killings of civilians. In four of those incidents, soldiers were found to have operated within rules of engagement. In the fifth case, a helicopter pilot and his commander face disciplinary action for removing a Shi'a banner from a tower, which led to an altercation with demonstrators in which one or more civilians may have been killed.

Krivo said investigations are ongoing into two fatal incidents. One centers on the Sept. 12 killing of eight Iraqi police officers and one Jordanian guard by soldiers of the 82nd Airborne Division. The other involves the killing of an Iraqi, he said, but no other details were provided.

The deaths Human Rights Watch documented fall into three categories: those that occurred in raids; those in which the group alleges that soldiers responded disproportionately and indiscriminately to attacks; and those of Iraqis who failed to stop at checkpoints.

"U.S. checkpoints constantly shift throughout Baghdad, and are sometimes not well marked, although sign visibility is improving," the report said. "A dearth of Arabic interpreters and poor understanding of Iraqi hand gestures cause confusion, with results that are sometimes fatal for civilians."

The report's author, Human Rights Watch consultant Fred Abrahams, said the report was limited to deaths in Baghdad because it was "the natural place to begin."

___

AP Special Correspondent Charles J. Hanley in Baghdad contributed to this report.


TOPICS: Foreign Affairs; Front Page News; Miscellaneous; News/Current Events
KEYWORDS: bs; civilian; death; iraq
What a bunch of horse manure!
1 posted on 10/21/2003 4:13:44 AM PDT by Core_Conservative
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To: Core_Conservative
Why don't we just leave and let Sadam and friends kill all the civilians they want /sarcasm
2 posted on 10/21/2003 4:14:57 AM PDT by Core_Conservative (To my wife, the Wonderful AND Beautiful - ODC-GIRL - Ready to Defend our Country 24x7!)
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To: Core_Conservative
Of course the bombs they had tied around their waist had nothing to do with their deaths.
3 posted on 10/21/2003 4:23:53 AM PDT by Always Right
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To: Core_Conservative
NPR this morning was bemoaning the fate of a grove of date palms which American soldiers cut down (because they had six attacks carried out against them from the grove).

They interviewed irate Iraqis and emphasized the fact that each tree took decades to grow.

It was evident from the report that NPR thinks trees are more important than American soldiers' lives.

4 posted on 10/21/2003 4:25:21 AM PDT by dawn53
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To: Core_Conservative
Perhaps "Human Rights Watch" could investigate how many Iraqis were killed by Baathists and AQ at the same time?

Oh ok that's not on the 'agenda' I see.
5 posted on 10/21/2003 4:26:19 AM PDT by Broadside Joe
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To: Core_Conservative
It seems to me that there is an effort to villify our soldiers. There has been an ugly story about the 101st Tigers from the Viet Nam war and a story about 8 Marines charged in a prisioner's death. And now this. The democrats are in a tough spot having to praise the troops for such good work early on and now trying to discredit the same for post Saddam efforts. This is just another attempt to invent a dark cloud for the silver lining.
6 posted on 10/21/2003 4:29:21 AM PDT by tbpiper
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To: tbpiper
That would be a perfect fit. right=wrong, good=bad, up=down and then 'is'=.....
7 posted on 10/21/2003 4:32:48 AM PDT by Broadside Joe
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To: tbpiper
I have lately told people that there is an orchestrated effort to demoralize and target our soldiers, and THAT is the parallel with Viet Nam (not "quagmire, and not "a new Tet"). Once they get the "baby killer" mantra going, then the spitting will start.

Perhaps the troops returning from overseas should get a crack at capturing and arresting some media people for attacks on American military personnel.

8 posted on 10/21/2003 4:35:01 AM PDT by niteowl77 (If you haven't prayed for our troops, please start; if you stopped, then do some catching up.)
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To: Core_Conservative
For the life of me I can't understand why we didn't declare the entire country off-limits for all foriegners. Nobody was allowed into Japan without permission from MacArthur's headquarters fo several years after the VE day.

Why are these various groups and news org's allowed to run at will?
9 posted on 10/21/2003 4:50:04 AM PDT by x1stcav ( HOOAHH!)
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To: x1stcav
Because then they would claim that we are hiding the the number of our troops killed and iraqis killed.

Then that we abusing the people ect ect ect..
10 posted on 10/21/2003 4:53:08 AM PDT by Broadside Joe
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To: Broadside Joe
Then that we ARE abusing the people ect ect ect
11 posted on 10/21/2003 4:56:16 AM PDT by Broadside Joe
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To: Broadside Joe
Agreed, but since they're going to say such things anyway why not save ourselves the grief?
12 posted on 10/21/2003 5:04:46 AM PDT by x1stcav ( HOOAHH!)
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To: x1stcav
Well it would seem so, but if you think about it at least this way we can have others there to point out the lies and spin.
13 posted on 10/21/2003 5:12:02 AM PDT by Broadside Joe
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To: Core_Conservative
"Human Rights Watch said it was able to confirm 20 civilian deaths caused by U.S. forces in Iraq's capital between May 1 and Sept. 30, ..."

20?? That's all?

I'm not trying to be funny --every life is precious, but if only 20 civilians have died in these incidents then I have to say that my admiration for the discipline of our military and their devotion to purity of arms has just gone up a few more notches. These kids are great.

14 posted on 10/21/2003 6:41:32 AM PDT by cookcounty
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Here's some numbers for HRW, 153 days, 20 dead civilians and over 100 dead americans... and HRW is complaining???
15 posted on 10/21/2003 1:10:41 PM PDT by Jammz ("The only thing needed for evil to prevail, is for good men to do nothing.")
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