Linux and the GPL, A Hard look at a Leftist Software Development model

Coral Snakes Shock 'n' Awe | 8-31-2003 | Coral Snake

[DaGman]

"THE BASIC GOAL IF THE "FREE SOFTWARE" MOVEMENT IS TO ELIMINATE THE COMMERCIAL SOFTWARE INDUSTRY AND REPLACE IT WITH A MARXIST COUNTERFEIT UNDER THE GPL..."

Lost me here... this is the silliest thing I've seen in quite a while.

[Wonder Warthog]

"Actually if you look at the multitude of SourceForge and FreshMeat FAILURES you can see that this form of communism is already starting to gove up the ghost too. Can anyone say "vaporware"? That's what about 90 percent of the projects on those web sites consists of."

Uh, I hate to rain on your parade, but that is just about the same failure rate as for "for-profit" business startups, software or otherwise--so by that criterion, the small-c "communisitic" approach is NOT failing--it is performing equally well (or badly, depending on whether you view the glass as half-empty or half-full).

[ThePythonicCow]

well said

[ThePythonicCow]

Well ... the GPL has clearly sapped at least one persons precious bodily fluids ... coral snake. He evidentally has drained much piss from his body and liberally spewed it about here.

[AndyJackson]

THE BASIC GOAL IF THE "FREE SOFTWARE" MOVEMENT IS TO ELIMINATE THE COMMERCIAL SOFTWARE INDUSTRY AND REPLACE IT WITH A MARXIST COUNTERFEIT UNDER THE GPL using essentially the Marxist "Dialectical Materialism" theory of Thesis v Antithesis = Synthesis. In this version of it "Free Software" is the Thesis, "Open Source" is the Antithesis and the elimination of commercial software is the Synthesis. In fact these neo hippie Marxists have disguised their attack on commercial software by calling standard commercial software proprietary software as negative buzzword against Intellectual Property in general while insisting that GPL software can be "commercial".

Sorry, Dude, but you kinda lost me here. This is how every whacko sign on a Berekeley streetcorner is written. After a while you stop trying to figure out what it means because it doesn't mean anything.

[chilepepper]

I think the cold and slithery one's big error is to try to frame all human exchange which has an extrinsic value in terms of money.

The open source movement is, IMHO, a post capitalist phenomena, and could NEVER originate from a socialist economy, because open-ness and sharing which arises from individuals with open source, more or less SPONTANEOUSLY, is exactly opposite the state imposed sharing so characteristic of planned economies.

In a sense, state imposed sharing strangles spontaneous/open sharing by individuals in its crib, while capitalism creates the surplus and good will which allows skillfull and highly competent individuals to develop quality stuff and GIVE IT AWAY just for the heck of it, for personal satisfaction, respect amongst peers, or perhaps to set up a marketable name for themselves which will eventually lead to a higher paying job...

George Gilder in Wealth and Poverty is much closer to the mark where he shows that giving away the goods and providing a service to people is actually the pure essence of capitalism.

[ThePythonicCow]

The driving force behind the current Linux/Gnu/GPL communism (with a small 'c') seems related to efforts by existing businesses to apply the manufacturing business model to software. In that model, the physical object is the essential precious object, and once you drive down the cost of design and setup with enough volume, then the selling price depends on the costs of materials, manufacturing, distribution, marketing and a competitive profit.

The five pound retail software box of paper, manuals, cardboard and ink that contains a 30 to 60 cent CD (mostly for printing the nice label) is a sign of a desparate effort to make $6 look like $60.

And why would the producer of a major software product be desparate to make $6 look like $60? Manufacturers of razor blades, cars and toasters don't routinely balloon their selling price by an order of magnitude -- they might fantasize doing such, but they are well aware that they'd go out of business if they tried.

The problem with software is that the costs of design and development, not of manufacturing and distribution, predominate.

Shared development software, which is what the GPL does a pretty good job of providing, dramatically reduces the costs of development, by sharing it with more people. Something like Linux has been a decade in developement and remains under more active change than ever. The software contained on a $12.99 CheapBytes Pink Tie Linux Full Set Vers. 9.0 (six CD's) is a huge effort, involving tens of thousands of programmers over decades.

Even the largest companies, eventually even Microsoft, and already IBM (migrating from MVS and such to Linux) cannot afford to keep proprietary software under the intense development that it takes to be world class in many categories.

In other words, communist GPL is succeeding for essentially capitalistic reasons. It produces the desired goods for dramatically less cost. This is because the cost of development is amortized over more users, and because, for software, to repeat myself, it's the cost of development that drives the price, not the cost of manufacturing and distribution (in this age of CD's and the internet).

You can get away with having a business model that is a little inefficient, because the costs of entry into a market by would-be competitors keeps them out.

But when your business model is an order of magnitude off, then you're a dinosaur, waiting for the comet to hit.

I'm not into music, but I suspect that the RIAA is also struggling to avoid learning this same lesson.

[zeugma]

The court case that led up to this article (SCO v IBM) is about FILCHING other people's code and using the GPL "poison pill" provision to justify the theft.

So far the 'filching' part has yet to be proven. The only proof offered by SCO so far was rapidly shot down in flames. The GPL and BSD licenses are all about freedom. It would seem that some people just can't handle freedom on such a massive scale.

[ThePythonicCow]

So far the 'filching' part has yet to be proven.

Indeed, it has been cast into extreme doubt. At this point anyone who would give SCO's case credence I would presume to be a fool or a shill.

If I hadn't already so presumed, as in this case ...

[Wonder Warthog]

"The open source movement is, IMHO, a post capitalist phenomena, and could NEVER originate from a socialist economy, because open-ness and sharing which arises from individuals with open source, more or less SPONTANEOUSLY, is exactly opposite the state imposed sharing so characteristic of planned economies."

I'm gonna both agree and disagree with you. Certainly the open source phenomenon could never originate from a "Marxist-style" socialist economy, but it is identically the same as the "community" economy practiced in frontier days (think of barn-raisings). One gives of his efforts to others in hopes of gaining a similar contribution FROM others at some future time. I think you would be hard put to say that THAT "economic style" is "post-capitalist".

[Coral Snake]

I don't mind giving software or source code away. But I believe if you do it should be TRUELY given away with little
(BSD/MIT) or NO (Public Domain) strings attached. Even if it is not communist the GPL is little more than a Microsoft
EULA on source code with the same legal doubletalk and "poison pills". It is NOT Freedom as in beer, speech or anything else.

[Coral Snake]

I don't think we have to worry all that much about Microsoft
competition and my next article will be explaining why. They may have 40 billion dollars in the bank but that only hides the fact that the company has been built on IP theft
and their financial structure is actually a house of cards built on quicksand waiting for any slip up in their revenue stream to "crack the surface" and sink them.

[chilepepper]

Good point about the barn-raising and "frontier" precursor to the open-source phenomena...

I would maintain though that in the old days folks did this because they didn't HAVE the "money" to do this sort of thing and needed help in raising a barn, for example.

I hold that what motivates folks to contribute to open-source is a lot more complex, since in many cases folks contribute more as a hobby than expecting a tangible reward such as quid-pro-quo, although no doubt the idea of "giving something back" is very strong if one has gotten good use of some piece of open-source software in the past...

[BlazingArizona]

The court case that led up to this article (SCO v IBM) is about FILCHING other people's code and using the GPL "poison pill" provision to justify the theft.

You seem to assume that SCO has an actual case. It doesn't, or it would have revealed the offending code by now. It's nothing but a pump-n-dump operation run by bullying suits. The geek community, commies and libertarians alike, will take great pleasure in busting up this scam.

[Coral Snake]

I would like to remind you that the VAST MAJORITY of the code involved is still under a STRICT NDA. SCO might just be giving you guys a false sense of security by releasing code that even they know they are probably going to lose on while keeping their REAL CASE secret in return for all the "pump 'n' dump" accusations and DDoS attacks.
My information relating to Microsoft stock fraud and "pump 'n' dumping" at least in their recent past comes from a REAL financial cunsultant's web site with no axes to gring against M$

www.billparish.com

as well as Yahoo Finance. I don't see ANY financial consultants saying that SCO is involved in similar operations. I only hear this on Linux shill and hacker sites like NewsForge and Slashfilth.

[Timesink]

However, we use a hardware key.

Does "hardware key" = dongle? Just curious about the mechanism.

[Timesink]

Why am I not seeing any of those graphics? I'm getting "no such server" errors.

[FreedomCalls]

If you would get off your lazy ass and write your own source code rather than stealing GPL'ed open source material you will have nothing to worry about. You are so far out in left field on this you are in a different ballpark. Try switching to decaf.

[Coral Snake]

That is a false accusation, profanity and a personal attack.

Quiet you!
NO personal attacks, NO profanity!!!

I would never even TOUCH most GPL source code let alone steal it and I DO write most of my own source (Except when I BUY third party redistributable componants or use BSD/MIT/PD stuff). I just can't stand hypocracy and leftism and I think the GPL practices BOTH.

[Coral Snake]

Wander where Golden Eagle is. He particularly wanted to read this.