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Was Vietnam worth the cost?
American Thinker ^ | 03/29/2024 | Charles Farlow

Posted on 03/30/2024 8:12:01 AM PDT by SeekAndFind

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To: mass55th

Yup!


101 posted on 03/30/2024 2:14:13 PM PDT by FlingWingFlyer (Xiden tries to come off as a tough guy but can't stop a herd of raggedy ass Mexicans from invading.)
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To: kearnyirish2

I do know that the guys in that unit during the 80s loved fighting in Chad, and they were right wingers who hated François Mitterrand.


102 posted on 03/30/2024 2:32:48 PM PDT by ansel12 ((NATO warrior under Reagan, and RA under Nixon, bemoaning the pro-Russians from Vietnam to Ukraine.))
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To: MinorityRepublican
"Putin is like Hitler. You have to knock him out until his nose bleeds."

And Russia certainly knocked Hitler out! What ever possessed Hitler to think that he could have conquered the whole of Russia, we'll never know. Russia is vast, and there was no way that Germany was ever going to defeat Russia. When Hitler invaded Russia, Stalin destroyed bridges, destroyed crops to make it harder for the Germans to advance. He even had entire steel and munitions plants in the western part of the country, dismantled and shipped by rail to the east, where they were rebuilt, and put back into use.

103 posted on 03/30/2024 2:37:14 PM PDT by mass55th (“Courage is being scared to death, but saddling up anyway.” ― John Wayne)
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To: mass55th
That's the problem of being a dictator. You're surrounded by "yes men".

Saddam. Hitler. Now Putin.

104 posted on 03/30/2024 2:38:21 PM PDT by MinorityRepublican
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To: SeekAndFind

No.

The Zeppers around here will say yes.


105 posted on 03/30/2024 2:39:50 PM PDT by moovova ("The NEXT election is the most important election of our lifetimes!“ LOL...)
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To: MinorityRepublican
I was a history major in college and close to a Czech emigre professor who had fought the Nazis and the Communists before moving to the US from Switzerland to avoid the clutches of the KGB. Prof. Luza was highly regarded as an area expert and consulted for US and Israeli intelligence.

Luza was politically liberal in the context of US domestic politics but was a staunch anticommunist. He thought that the Soviet Union was likely to prevail in the Cold War. He stated to me that before Reagan's election in 1980, Europe was on the verge of a deal with the USSR.

As Prof. Luza explained, Europe was to get iron clad security guarantees in return for abandoning NATO and giving the USSR and the Warsaw Pact access to European financing, technology, and markets. When I last saw Luza, his assessment was that with Reagan as president, the Soviet Union and communism might be defeated.

As it was, the Soviet Union did not fall apart like a house of cards. Reagan and his team pulled the supports out and gave the rotten edifice a hard shove.

For some interesting reading, peruse the Reagan era national security directives and memoranda that laid out the strategy in formal terms. They are available on the internet.

106 posted on 03/30/2024 2:48:40 PM PDT by Rockingham (`)
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To: MinorityRepublican
"That's the problem of being a dictator. You're surrounded by "yes men". Saddam. Hitler. Now Putin."

The claims of Putin wanting to take over the world, is the same crap propaganda about Russia, and the "Red Scare" that I heard as a kid in the 50's and 60's. George W. Bush, in his last year in office, allowed Putin to invade Georgia. In 2014, Obama allowed Putin to annex Croatia. Obama had two years left in his second term, and he did nothing. Since neither of them batted an eyelash, why didn't Putin push even farther since he'd already tested the waters and found nobody was going to challenge him? Why did he wait 7 years until Biden got in office to make a move on Ukraine, if he was so intent on reforming the U.S.S.R. as people who support the war in Ukraine believe. Why did Putin stop in 2014, when his previous moves showed the west didn't really give a crap?

The biggest threat to this country isn't Putin. It's the Biden Whitehouse, and the RATS and Repukes that support sending billions of unaccounted-for money to a country 5,000 miles away, that is the size of Texas, and which American has no national security interest in. It's also the thousands of illegal aliens, criminals, Chinese, middle-eastern, diseased and mentally ill individuals roaming around this country unsupervised. Putin is the least of our problems.

This whole crap with Ukraine started when info was circled that Ukraine was going to join NATO. Ukraine's first interest in joining NATO came in 2002. In 2006, Ukraine's President Yushchenko became more serious about joining.

At the "Bucharest Summit Declaration" issued April 3, 2008, it was officially announced that: "NATO welcomes Ukraine's and Georgia's Euro-Atlantic aspirations for membership in NATO. We agreed today that these countries will become members of NATO. Both nations have made valuable contributions to Alliance operations. We welcome the democratic reforms in Ukraine and Georgia and look forward to free and fair parliamentary elections in Georgia in May. MAP is the next step for Ukraine and Georgia on their direct way to membership. Today we make clear that we support these countries' applications for MAP. Therefore we will now begin a period of intensive engagement with both at a high political level to address the questions still outstanding pertaining to their MAP applications. We have asked Foreign Ministers to make a first assessment of progress at their December 2008 meeting. Foreign Ministers have the authority to decide on the MAP applications of Ukraine and Georgia."

Fast forward to September 2022, Zelensky formally applies to NATO for Ukraine membership. All those years, from 2002 when Ukraine first thought of joining, up to and including Zelensky's application, then the NATO announcement in 2008, and then crickets. 16 years have passed since that NATO statement. The Biden Administration back in 2021, clearly stated that Ukraine would become a member soon. Then in July of 2023, Biden said Ukraine "is not ready to be a member of NATO." WTF???

In the meantime, Sweden mouthed their intent and applied to NATO in May-June 2022, and were admitted on or about April 3, 2023. So what happened in the meantime to Ukraine, who was the actual country being threatened? Sweden was whisked in quickly, but Ukraine is still standing out in the cold. What the hell is really going on? And during WWII, Sweden claimed neutrality, so Hitler wouldn't invade them, but they were far from neutral.

Murky truth of how a neutral Sweden covered up its collaboration with Nazis

Sweden was no different than Switzerland when it came to helping the Nazis.

107 posted on 03/30/2024 3:26:16 PM PDT by mass55th (“Courage is being scared to death, but saddling up anyway.” ― John Wayne)
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To: mass55th
The claims of Putin wanting to take over the world, is the same crap propaganda about Russia, and the "Red Scare" that I heard as a kid in the 50's and 60's. George W. Bush, in his last year in office, allowed Putin to invade Georgia. In 2014, Obama allowed Putin to annex Croatia. Obama had two years left in his second term, and he did nothing. Since neither of them batted an eyelash, why didn't Putin push even farther since he'd already tested the waters and found nobody was going to challenge him? Why did he wait 7 years until Biden got in office to make a move on Ukraine, if he was so intent on reforming the U.S.S.R. as people who support the war in Ukraine believe. Why did Putin stop in 2014, when his previous moves showed the west didn't really give a crap?

If Russia is so great, you can move there. How about St. Petersburg or Moscow. I wouldn't bring the American passport, if I were you.

108 posted on 03/30/2024 3:29:59 PM PDT by MinorityRepublican
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To: mass55th

Yes, but the Viermise HATE China.


109 posted on 03/30/2024 5:52:14 PM PDT by cowboyusa (AT THIS POINT, I'M WARMING TO AN AMERICAN PINOCHETE. )
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To: SeekAndFind; All

While we were fighting in Nam, the Soviets overtook us military Interestingly l, The John Birch Society opposed the war as a distraction from Marxist infiltration here.


110 posted on 03/30/2024 5:56:26 PM PDT by cowboyusa (AT THIS POINT, I'M WARMING TO AN AMERICAN PINOCHETE. )
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To: Chengdu54

LBJ EGO (power) + Robert McNamara EGO (statistics)


111 posted on 03/30/2024 6:06:28 PM PDT by linMcHlp
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To: cowboyusa
"Yes, but the Viermise HATE China."

If you meant Vietnamese, North Vietnam didn't hate them during the Vietnam War. China aided North Vietnam against the South and the United States.

112 posted on 03/30/2024 6:24:06 PM PDT by mass55th (“Courage is being scared to death, but saddling up anyway.” ― John Wayne)
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To: Gaffer

No. From that perspective the power it gave to the liberals it was not. In addition, restraint on warfare isn’t worth it. Either fight to destroy or don’t fight but don’t ask men to to die in a half azz war


113 posted on 03/30/2024 6:27:44 PM PDT by wgmalabama (Censored!)
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To: MinorityRepublican
"If Russia is so great, you can move there."

Show me the quote where I said Russia was great, and why you got that notion from what I wrote. What elementary school level do you read at. You're another one of those people on FR who can't read, can't comprehend what you read, nor retain what you read.

114 posted on 03/30/2024 6:31:40 PM PDT by mass55th (“Courage is being scared to death, but saddling up anyway.” ― John Wayne)
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To: FlingWingFlyer
The communists kicked us out and Vietnam went full commie. Now they are one of our major trading partners and Vietnam is one of America’s favorite places to vacation and spend their money.

And Vietnamese youth today lament the actions of their parents and grandparents.

"We could've been Seoul or Tokyo is only we let the Americans stay." is a popular sentiment.

115 posted on 03/30/2024 6:37:24 PM PDT by Drew68
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To: redcatcherb412

A friend was 17. Landed on Omaha Beach, start of 3rd week of June 1944. Immediately sent to Cherbourgh. Combat, there, followed by combat from there . . . walking all the way across France to frontier near Germany, northeast from Paris.

December 22, pulled from the line and sent to Paris, but did not get there. Stopped short because of change in orders - back to the front.

After Ardennes, headed toward Austria. War ends. Duty. Transfer to France for pre-boarding; shipped out.

Lands at New York City, 19th birthday.

I asked him, What do you remember most?

He said, The bodies in the ditches alongside the roads.

The Germans killed a lot of people that we do not hear about, and the bodies were dumped in the roadside ditches. In time - in photos, you don’t notice the bodies, because of the effects of nature. The remains of people, their clothes, etc. blend in.

My friend was my brother-in-law whom some people looked down upon, because he was seemingly simple and weak.

He resolved to be himself, a kind gentleman, and he found that he liked selling clothing as a way to keep afloat and associate with people - to keep from turning inward.

Few knew about his “teenage years.” He gave of himself, he was devoted to my sister and to the kids.

He was very tall and strong, Irish. His kind treatment of people, generous with his time for their sakes, still shows in their children.

Thank you for listening. Thank you for showing up.

Blessings


116 posted on 03/30/2024 6:43:06 PM PDT by linMcHlp
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To: mass55th
Two guys in my senior class that joined up right after graduation, died in Vietnam. One of them sat behind me in homeroom.

I've really struggled coming up with an appropriate response that didn't sound trite, but felt a response was necessary. Guess all I can say is that's horrible. Know it was a long time ago but must still hurt. Prayers.

117 posted on 03/31/2024 12:04:17 AM PDT by piytar
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To: kearnyirish2
Post-colonial Africa was a mess...

When hasn't Africa been a mess?

118 posted on 03/31/2024 12:05:34 AM PDT by piytar
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To: SeekAndFind

The democrats back then as now undermined America and Vietnam people and millions died because of their treason.


119 posted on 03/31/2024 12:34:59 AM PDT by minnesota_bound (Need more money to buy everything now)
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To: Regulator; PGR88
The great irony is - we left Vietnam alone for 25 years after 1975, and now its a developing, friendly, and Pro-American place

In the years immediately following the war, any white person who visited Vietnam and went out among the people had to learn this phrase: "Không phải là Liên Xô" (I am not a Soviet).

120 posted on 03/31/2024 8:52:55 AM PDT by Fiji Hill
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